Planning Remote Overland Expeditions in Namibia: Logistics, Training, and Vehicle Prep with Land Rover

Guest Bio:

Emma Easter- Senior Office, Global Planning and Events
David Sneath- Land Rover Expedition Leader, Director Land Rover Experience (previous), Vehicle Engineer (previous)

Scott Brady

Scott Brady is an adventurer, author, and publisher, and the first person in history to cross all seven continents. Brady is executive publisher of the Overland Collective, home to Overland Journal, the Overland Journal Podcast, and expeditionportal.com—the world’s largest vehicle-dependent adventure community. Scott wrote Overlanding 101 (Simon & Schuster) and is currently riding around the world on his BMW GS. He also led Expeditions 7, the first expedition to drive the same vehicle on all seven continents. Brady’s polar crossings include Antarctica and a south–north crossing of the Greenland ice sheet. Scott is a fellow of the Explorers Club and lives in Prescott, Arizona.

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Transcript

Scott Brady: [00:00:00] Hello and welcome to the Overland Journal Podcast. I’m your host, Scott Brady, and I am here in beautiful northern Namibia, and we’re near the town of Opuwo, and I just spent the last few days with the Land Rover team evaluating the new Defender. And I’m here with two very interesting folks, people that I think can really shed some insights into overland travel, especially in remote locations like this.

We have David Sneath, who is the expedition leader for this particular trip, and Emma Easter, who handles a lot of the logistics for this kind of expedition And they’re gonna talk about what they’ve learned, the lessons that they’ve learned along the way from these kinds of expeditions. Now, both of them are extremely experienced.

Imagine having a full-time job of introducing others to new vehicles as they come to market, and in particular, Land Rover, who has this storied history of exploring the world with their vehicles. And they’ve always done it this way. [00:01:00] They’ve always been very well-planned in their logistics, and I think that there’s a lot of lessons that we can take away from that.

So thank you both Emma and David for being on the podcast today.

Emma Easter: You’re welcome.

David Sneath: It’s good to see

Scott Brady: you. Thanks. Absolutely. So David, you have had a long history with Land Rover. How long have you been working- Uh- -for Land Rover?

David Sneath: Over 40 years now.

Scott Brady: Oh, that’s fan- that’s fantastic. Yeah. And I think that alone says so much about the organization, that you can maintain a passion for a brand like that for so long.

David Sneath: Yes, it’s been an extraordinary, uh, experience throughout. It obviously has its highs and lows, but, uh, yeah, it, uh, it gets, it gets under your skin. It’s a passion.

Scott Brady: Yeah, no, I can, I can see that. And we were having a conversation before the podcast started, and your career included you being an engineer- Yes

on multiple platforms. Uh, so I

David Sneath: was an apprentice and then became an engineer. Worked in engineering for 22, 23 years. Then moved on into marketing.

Scott Brady: And, and you, you got your [00:02:00] chops the hard way. I mean, you started with P38, which would’ve been a challenging thing, and then you helped design the Mark 3 Range Rover, which I think was one of the best Range Rovers ever built for both that combination of capability and luxury.

David Sneath: Yes, it was a, a transformation in the, in the Range Rover brand. And I, I suppose my key role was to maintain its ability to cover some of the difficult terrain as well as improving the on-road performance, so.

Scott Brady: Yeah, it was shocking to see… I mean, it, it, for a luxury SUV to start to see locking rear differentials, and if I recall, the first, the early Mark 3 Range Rovers had exceptional articulation and wheel travel, which was unheard of in the class.

David Sneath: Yes, no, that, that was, uh, the real first intr- introduction of independent suspension with the air suspension combination and such things as cross-link valves between the front axle and the rear axle, as in side to side-

Scott Brady: Sure …

David Sneath: uh, really gave us that, uh, capability.

Scott Brady: And that, that would [00:03:00] create this forced articulation, so as o- as the- One wheel was compressing, it was forcing air pressure into the downward wheel.

So it-

David Sneath: Yes, I mean, basically the way it worked was at a certain speed, the link valve would open, which would allow the airbag on the side of, uh, the car that was being pushed up into the wheel arch to go further, ’cause the air had somewhere to go, and that pushed the air into the spring on the opposite side of the axle.

Mm. Which then meant that you, you, you always had contact with the ground with each tire.

Scott Brady: And that makes sense. And then at a certain speed you wouldn’t want that to happen because you’d get a lot of bo- body roll. Yeah. Force body roll . Force body roll, yeah, out, out of

David Sneath: the vehicle. ‘Cause obviously the breadth of capability or the dynamics, uh, was, was key to us as well.

Scott Brady: Yeah. What a, what an interesting vehicle, and what a series of interesting vehicles you both have worked on. And Emma, you’ve been with Land Rover, you said, for about four years now.

Emma Easter: Yes.

Scott Brady: And you are, you’re handling a lot of the logistics and planning. So gi- give the listener a scope of what is involved for you with [00:04:00] planning an expedition into northern Namibia in the middle of nowhere.

Emma Easter: Well, we do roll it right back to 18, 12 months, where we look at the car, what attributes we wanna show, all of that. We work with our engineering team, our product team. And then we look at the location and what road routes we wanna do and what location is gonna suit the car. So we do… You know, we talk amongst ourselves, and then we do some desktop research about the countries and political state and everything like that.

And then a few of us narrow it down to, you know, where, where is, where’s gonna be the best, and then we go out on our recce and actually see the places. David looks at the road routes. He finds something good, we look at the venues, we look at airports. Can we get people in and out easily? Oh, sure. Like, all the finite details.

‘Cause if you can’t get people into the country easily, then, yeah, you’re not gonna have an event. Um-

Scott Brady: Yeah. It was so impressive to watch how, how well everything ran. In fact, yesterday morning, David, you said, “We’re gonna [00:05:00] get into camp around 6:30,” and I looked at my watch, and we arrived at 6:32. Now, it’s not that we were on this purely scripted adventure yesterday.

We, we went down towards the Skeleton Coast. We went up a river basin. We had vehicles that were stuck. We were doing winching and kinetic recoveries. We were stopping for photo shoots, and we still arrived within two minutes – … of your estimation, which I’m sure that that doesn’t happen every time, but what it does show me is that there is a lot of intention behind that.

And I think that that’s something that we can all learn as travelers. It, we want to allow for serendipity. We want to allow for experiences and adventures to occur. But the more that we plan things, the better likelihood we have that we don’t end up with that cascade of events where people start to get tired and they start to make poor judgments.

Uh, what are some of the things that you have found, David, in planning these trips? That allows you to make sure that people aren’t being overtaxed, the vehicle isn’t being [00:06:00] overtaxed, et cetera.

David Sneath: Um, for me, the, the Three things. One is preparation. It’s all down to preparation. So it’s people preparation and vehicle preparation.

If you look at people, have they had the right training? Have they got the… You know, do they fit into the team? For me, you’ve got to have a very tight team to be able to deliver this with the intensity that we are here.

Scott Brady: Yeah.

David Sneath: Um, we all need to help each other. So, uh, there is no such thing as, “I, I haven’t quite finished yet.”

Everybody won’t sit down- Mm … until everybody’s finished.

Scott Brady: Right.

David Sneath: Um, so, you know, uh, Emma has explained that she’s looking after logistics. So when we did lunch for you yesterday, we weren’t just sat there waiting to do the next bit of driving. Mm-hmm. We were helping, uh, Emma do what she’s trying to do, and then vice versa.

So that, that’s key. So people, people prep. H- Has Emma, Emma went and… who hasn’t had a lot of experience in driving in these conditions. So we sent her down to Easner to allow her to get experience- Mm-hmm … in the cars before she comes.

Scott Brady: Sure.

David Sneath: Um, there’s a

Scott Brady: lot of- And [00:07:00] how, how was that experience, Emma, going through Easner training?

Emma Easter: Well, it was epic. It was amazing. But then you come somewhere like this, and it doesn’t- Doesn’t necessarily translate? … doesn’t compare. But what we’ve got at Easner is, is an amazing experience, but nothing from driving on sand to the mud we experienced these last couple of days. It’s just been great, and I’ve been sent out with an instructor here, and just learning everything has just been fantastic.

Like, I’ve got skills for life now with my driving. Yeah,

Scott Brady: that’s one thing that I think Land Rover has always done an exceptional job of- … is how do you train up people to be able to do these kinds of expeditions? Uh, and I think back to the Camel Trophy and how much Land Rover was involved with that. How much were you involved with the Camel Trophy, David?

I,

David Sneath: I, I was buried in engineering when that was going on. Sure. So I just touched the end of the Freelander, uh, in Patagonia-

Scott Brady: Uh-huh …

David Sneath: expedition. Yeah, I was buried in Munich working – Sure … on the Range Rover. Uh, but then I, I got involved in the sort of, [00:08:00] I suppose, the, the, the son or cousin of, as in G4s. G4, sure.

The G4s. Uh, and did, did all of those, ’cause I’d moved in to run Land Rover Experience then, so.

Scott Brady: Oh, that would be- Yeah. What an experience that would’ve been. Oh, it was. ‘Cause so you did Bolivia and all of those.

David Sneath: Yeah, they, they were just phenomenal- Ah … experiences. But, uh… And then we did, we’ve done other programs since then.

You know, we’ve, we’ve done, uh, Argentina with Discovery 3. Mm. We did, uh, Iceland back in 2005, and it snowed. You know, it’s, um-

Scott Brady: Sure.

David Sneath: Yeah. We’ve, we’ve had some epic experiences. Yeah. Epic. And that- That’s all learning as well. Yeah.

Scott Brady: Yeah, it i- it certainly is. And that, that kind of leads me on to the idea of Land Rover has always prided themselves on doing these expeditions with essentially stock vehicles.

Yeah. Absolutely. But you do need to upfit them in a way that makes them more safe, potentially more capable, but also work better suited for the conditions- Mm-hmm … in some ways. I noticed that there were Some vehicle accessories that were added, Land Rover accessories, some [00:09:00] non-Land Rover accessories. Tell me about how you normally look at how to upfit or prepare these cars for these remote expeditions.

David Sneath: Um, well, once you’ve understood the, the, the base car, the base product, uh, and you’ve understood the accessories, you then have to look about where you’re going.

Scott Brady: Mm.

David Sneath: And, um, you know, if you’re in mainland Europe, you wouldn’t need to carry a- an extra spare wheel, for example, because you could have a, a depot where you could get them from.

Mm. But here we’re, we’re out from Apoyo, which is the last sort of center of- Yeah … logistics that you’ve got. Yeah. And we’re, we’re out for three days. Mm. And we’re gonna… We’re covering over 680 kilometers in pretty arduous conditions. And if you need a spare wheel, somebody can’t run one out to you. No.

You’ve got to take everything with you. So you look at the base car, you look at the accessories that you can get, and then you think, “Well, what else do I need?” So we took, for example, the roof rack, we took the s- standard roof rack, uh, and then we said, “Right, we’ve got to fit an extra spare wheel up there.”

Mm. A lot of [00:10:00] people use straps. Uh, I don’t like straps ’cause they wear out quite quickly, especially with the, uh, conditions that we’re in. Mm. So we developed in-house an extra wheel quick release mechanism that you’ve seen. I saw that. Quite good. It goes on the cars. We put high-lift jacks on because some of the rivers that we’re going through, they’re very, very boggy as you saw yesterday.

Mm-hmm. And to be able to lift a car out when you can’t winch it ’cause it’s sucked in, um, that- that’s really important. Uh- And,

Scott Brady: and how would you… I noticed that there were, there were lunettes on the rear of the vehicle- Mm … rear recovery points- Mm … that would easily accept-

David Sneath: Mm-hmm …

Scott Brady: the claw of a high lift.

Yeah. How would you lift the front of the vehicle with a high lift?

David Sneath: Uh, on a monocoque I don’t like using a h- I mean, high-lift jacks, as you know- Sure, sure … are, are lethal bits of equipment- Sure … in inexperienced hands.

Scott Brady: Right.

David Sneath: And so what we have, we have the wheel lift. That makes sense. So we put that through the spokes- Yeah

so it’s pushing on the top of the rim. And I suppose, uh, not the last resort, but yeah, you, you’ve gotta be really stuck to be wanting to use one of those.

Scott Brady: And I noticed that [00:11:00] yesterday when we were doing vehicle recoveries, you guys brought along a long recovery rope. Now it looked like it was, um, a- Uh, it was a dynamic rope, but it wasn’t a kinetic energy rope.

David Sneath: Correct. Uh, kinetic energy ropes, uh, and we do have them for the deep sand, uh, again, can be… You have to respect them with a great deal of respect.

Scott Brady: Yeah, they’re less precise,

David Sneath: for sure. Yeah, yeah. And so therefore, uh, we have three sizes of rope. We have a meter, short, short one, uh, five meter, and then 10 meters.

So you saw us use our 10-meter yesterday. Mm-hmm. Um, and there’s a certain amount of give in those ropes. Sure. Um, and that allows for delicate removal. Um-

Scott Brady: Sure, and I saw that with the one vehicle-to-vehicle- Yeah … that you did yesterday. That was great.

David Sneath: Yeah. So I mean, it’s, you know, yesterday we used the front recovery point, which is sort of 65 kilonewton capacity.

Scott Brady: Mm-hmm.

David Sneath: So it can take a snatch.

Scott Brady: Mm-hmm.

David Sneath: But why do that? Because, you know, there’s a lot of mass flying around.

Scott Brady: Sure.

David Sneath: Uh, and [00:12:00] of course, you guys are very keen to watch what’s going on, so I’ve, I’ve gotta manage the safety of all of those recovery- Sure … situations.

Scott Brady: And you guys did a great job of that. You had good hand signals, very clear communication.

The re- all of the spotting was also very excellent as well. You know, roll down the windows, listen to the verbal commands. You guys had very clear- Hand signals in addition. And then on the, on the winching recovery, I also noticed that, uh, you guys were working in concert on that as well. Yeah. And you, you had an external operator of the winch controller as opposed to the driver of the other vehicle.

What was some of the motivation behind that strategy?

David Sneath: Uh, I think when you’re, uh, using a vehicle to recover another vehicle- Mm … in the instance that we had yesterday, it is far better because you’re making sure that you’re paying the rope on- Sure … uh, in, in a neat fashion because- You’re able to watch it

with the winch installation you’ve got, it is sort of in a, inside a post box ’cause it’s a, uh, a covered winch. It’s not quite as easy. And if you’ve got the people, then you should use them. And- Mm-hmm … and every [00:13:00] recovery for me is a training opportunity to make sure. So, you know, for example, Emma, who’s never winched in, uh, before, uh, and probably wouldn’t in the office as it were Sure.

She’s been sat in the vehicle, and she’s been helping us with that, you know, putting your foot on the brake, keeping the engine RPM up to make sure- Sure … the battery isn’t being depleted. You’re

Emma Easter: always learning.

David Sneath: Always learning. And, and I think you saw the recovery yesterday where the car was completely bogged- It was

in very gloopy soil, sand, gravel. It was. And you’ve got to communicate with the driver that’s trying to drive the, uh, vehicle that’s being extracted out at the same time. So- Sure … it’s key to have as many good communication.

Scott Brady: Yeah, I saw that, and it, they both went off without a hitch. And- Mm … you guys made a couple corrections along the way to allow the vehicle to get pulled out, which was really neat, really neat to see.

Mm. And it looks like you g- you guys had a couple other accessories. You had the, you had the high-lift, and you had some r- looked like RotopaX for additional fuel.

David Sneath: Yes, that’s right. Yes. Yes, they are.

Scott Brady: Um, because we were right at the [00:14:00] limits of the range of the gasoline cars. The diesels had no trouble with the route, but-

David Sneath: Yeah,

Scott Brady: I mean-

we were towards the limits of- In

David Sneath: the deep sand, uh, especially when you’re in sand mode, uh, people are driving those cars enthusiastically, as you- Sure … saw in the river. The only fuel station that we’ve got on this whole trip is here in Napoa.

Scott Brady: Sure.

David Sneath: So I have to have fuel dumps, as we call them, at our overnight stops.

Scott Brady: Uh-huh.

David Sneath: And, um, some of the journeys that we’re doing are beyond the normal c- and there isn’t a fuel station.

Scott Brady: Mm-hmm.

David Sneath: So we have to, uh, carry everything with us.

Scott Brady: And I saw that you guys also had some recovery boards on the, on the rack as well. Have you started to use those more regularly?

David Sneath: Uh, yes, especially in sand.

On the recces, you know, when you’ve really got yourself and then, and one other vehicle, not eight vehicles. Sure. And they w- they work fantastically, and they work both in mud and sand and Yeah, you can use them for many, many things.

Scott Brady: And has that been a relatively recent addition, or has, or has Land Rover always used them but they would just use the Marsden matting before?

David Sneath: Tended [00:15:00] historically to use the aluminum sand- Yeah … ladders- Sure … or bolt, which are not particularly good for providing grip. They’re- They’re not, yeah … they’re, you know, they d- they, they have their purpose, but the, these new lightweight ones are, are fantastic, and uh-

Scott Brady: Yeah, I think they work really well

David Sneath: they’re easy to extract from the sand when the car’s sort of buried them.

Scott Brady: Yeah.

David Sneath: Yeah, they work really well.

Scott Brady: Yeah, it’s so cool. Those, for those that are listening too, we g- the noises you can hear in the background, we’ve got some guinea fowl that’s moving through the camp now, and, and other bird life. It’s just really, it’s very cool to be in this location.

This part of… Yeah, in fact we’ve got a local cat just walk- walking by. This is a beautiful part of the world. Uh, what, what inspires you? ‘Cause it looks like you’re definitely trying to test the vehicle, but what are some of the characteristics that you’re looking for when you’re planning a route?

David Sneath: Uh, for me, it has to be a journey.

Uh, I’m sort of almost a little obsessive with it’s gotta be a journey. Doing loops out of places with no purpose. Mm-hmm. So I look at the attributes of the vehicle, [00:16:00] what we’re trying to show, and then I go and find, and keep searching till I find the routes that suit those attributes. Um, so it’s, I mean, very difficult here to talk about on road- Sure

because we’ve got no sealed surface. We’ve got about two kilometers of that. That’s,

Scott Brady: that’s it,

David Sneath: yeah. Um, and that’s- Which

Scott Brady: I loved.

David Sneath: Yeah. I thought that was great. So I don’t think guys really believed me in the briefing- … when I said, “As soon as we go past the traffic lights, that’s it for three days, no tarmac.”

Scott Brady: Yeah.

David Sneath: Um, but it, it really is true. That was awesome.

Scott Brady: That was awesome.

David Sneath: Um, and it’s about finding key features on that journey that test the vehicle out, and allow you to test it in a real environment. Uh, I mean, I could build anything anywhere, but that wouldn’t be authentic.

Scott Brady: Right.

David Sneath: So everything is authentic.

Scott Brady: Yeah.

David Sneath: Part of the journey is to see the views, the vistas, the people, uh, the wildlife, um, and you do that by going to remote places. ‘Cause if you’re on a, on a, what I call a tourist trail-

Scott Brady: Sure …

David Sneath: uh, then you don’t get quite the same experience. Um, and so Epupa is really the sort of most northerly [00:17:00] place that people come to.

There’s very few people that go where we’re taking you guys.

Scott Brady: No question. In fact, Vanzella’s Pass that we did a few days ago is considered A serious destination for overland travelers. Uh, people will come from around the world to have the opportunity- Mm … to go experience that, and it was quite technical and it s- it certainly showcased the vehicle, and we could see by the carcasses of other cars at the bottom of the hill- Yeah

that there were, that

Emma Easter: there were people that-

Scott Brady: Scattered stuff … people that didn’t, that didn’t do well. Quite make it. Yeah. Either the vehicle wasn’t suitable for it or the driver wasn’t suitable for it. And that’s a, that’s a reminder of where we… We were so remote that if we had had any really serious incident, that would be quite a bit to get somebody out.

David Sneath: Yeah, and that’s part of the planning that we put into it. So Lee, our medic, is traveling with us at, at all times, and he’s s- you know, looking after everything. Mm. The wellbeing of people, how people are feeling, if there are any insect bites, all that type of stuff. Sure. But also [00:18:00] if something untoward was to take place, then we’re, we’re on it first point.

Emma Easter: Yeah. Sure.

David Sneath: And then the risk assess- And

Emma Easter: communication as well. So you’ve got your phones that- Yeah … reach out anywhere you are that can call help. And- Get a helicopter in if needs

Scott Brady: be. And Emma, how do you interact with both, like, the first, the medical teams? ‘Cause it, it looks like you very much are focusing on wellness and the overall health of the group as well.

Emma Easter: Yeah. It’s important to make sure everyone’s, you know, drinking enough water, not too tired. Like, three days driving is, is a lot. Driver changes regularly. Um, are people eating? And, like, we’ve got Lee from a medical you’ve got bite or- Sure … anything like that, whereas I’m a bit more the other side, uh, you know, people talking to each other, getting out, stretching their legs.

Yeah, so there’s not an accident and everyone’s looked after.

Scott Brady: And that is a good indicator, the one you just mentioned. Are people talking to each other? I notice that as people become more insular and they become more quiet, that usually is an [00:19:00] indication of something else that’s happening systemic, either within the group or within that individual.

Once they start to be… They, they stop smiling. Yeah. They stop communicating and talking with others. They might be getting dehydrated. They might be getting exhausted. Mm-hmm. And is that what you guys are looking for when you’re out there?

Emma Easter: Yeah, yeah, and it’s quite nice on that long stretch we did, like yesterday, where everyone was feeling a bit tired, but we’re all talking to each other and saying, “Cow’s in the road” or- Sure

“Watch out for this turn, this dip.” And it’s nice. People are having to pick up the radio and, you know-

David Sneath: Oh, that’s

Emma Easter: smart … get thinking and-

David Sneath: So they don’t get tired.

Emma Easter: Yeah.

David Sneath: Yeah, ’cause some of the, uh, trips in a similar way like this, everything was on me for communication.

Scott Brady: Right.

David Sneath: And, you know, that, that’s fine, but I, I did find that that didn’t bring the younger members of the team on- Mm

in their skill set Uh, because it’s all a learning opportunity, as Emma’s explained. Sure. And so we’ve all got a role. So Alex is our orator. Yeah. So he’s giving you all the facts and figures. He did such a great job.

Scott Brady: Oh,

Emma Easter: yeah.

David Sneath: Yeah. And, [00:20:00] uh, that allows me to concentrate on navigation and making sure… Like for example, in Skeleton Coast, we had the warden, and they’re very concerned about what we’re doing and, uh- Where you’re going.

Yeah … where we’re going. And so there’s a constant communication- Mm … with her, uh, as she’s in our car with us, and I’m feeding that out to the instructors to say, “Right, watch out for this, do that.” And that allows Alex to talk about the stuff that’s going on, and I’m sort of managing the ship in the background.

Scott Brady: Oh, yeah. So, uh- And you guys did s- you guys did such a great job. What are some things that in addition to this particular trip, David, like for example, around G4, what were some additional considerations that you had for the vehicles in those environments?

David Sneath: I think it’s really, uh, ensuring that you understand the environments you’re going into before you specify the vehicle.

Mm. ‘Cause obviously we’re a global car manufacturer. Mm. So do you want right-hand drive? Do you want left-hand drive? Uh, what features do you want on the car? You know, do you want air conditioning? Do you not want air conditioning? Mm. Do you want [00:21:00] petrol? Do you want diesel? Uh, as well as the sort of basic off-road features.

Do you need a roof rack so you can put your kayak on? Mm-hmm. Do you want to put a bike on? Do you need, uh, recovery points? Do you need a tow bar?

Scott Brady: Sure.

David Sneath: All of those things that you’re going through the spec list, they’re key to getting right in the first place.

Scott Brady: In all of the trips that you’ve done, what was your favorite trip that you’ve done for Land Rover in this regard?

David Sneath: I think all of them are favorites.

Scott Brady: Yeah.

David Sneath: Uh, and we’ve got some very fond memories, as you heard Nick and I talking at dinner last night. Right. From having to push that little bit further beyond the edge of what you would consider a normal office job to be, to make sure that we get you home. Because we don’t know what’s gonna happen out there.

Scott Brady: Sure.

David Sneath: So two days before you came here, massive, massive biblical ra-rains.

Scott Brady: Rains, yeah.

David Sneath: And that just took all the routes out of the river that we drove yesterday. So that river we were driving yesterday in November had [00:22:00] grass, little odd pools to drive through, and you saw how epic it was yesterday.

Scott Brady: It was impressive.

David Sneath: Yeah, and that’s me just sort of reading the ground, like it’s sort of hard there, it’s soft there. And occasionally you get it wrong, but that creates this fantastic- … adventure that we’ve been on.

Scott Brady: Yeah, you guys were doing 100% dead reckoning through that, whatever.

David Sneath: Yeah.

Scott Brady: Mm. There was no definable route through there.

David Sneath: No. And it changes every day.

Scott Brady: Sure.

David Sneath: That, that’s the key thing. And, uh, Matt, who’s with me, hasn’t done as much as we’ve done, and so I’ve got him driving. And so I suppose in a way I’m instructing him-

Scott Brady: Sure …

David Sneath: as we go along, because that builds the confidence, and it’s like Emma is driving herself. Yes, okay, I’ve got the tick to go to Esna, but actually she’s learning every day, she’s explained.

Yeah.

Scott Brady: Well, one of the things I noticed, Emma, was that you did a great job with brake modulation. Very smooth. You were, you were. Oh, yeah. You did a great job, and that shows that- The company has invested in your driving skills, which will just-

Emma Easter: Yeah …

Scott Brady: mean [00:23:00] future expeditions for you.

Emma Easter: Yeah. That’s great. Well, that’s the third time

I’d come down that pass. Uh-huh. First time, nearly ran David over. But every time. And I just grow in confidence every time. And you just, you can feel the car and-

David Sneath: Mm-hmm …

Emma Easter: you just, it builds and builds and builds. It’s-

David Sneath: Yeah …

Emma Easter: it’s a great feeling when you get to the bottom as well.

David Sneath: I mean, th- this new vehicle, the, the Defender, has a character.

And for me, if a car’s got a character, it just makes me come alive. Yeah. And you just, you feel the passion and that, that, it’s infectious. Mm. And it infects our core team that takes you out. But it’s infected all of the journalists that have been on- Mm-hmm … this trip with us. And when you arrive, you’re all a bit jet lagged from the travel.

Oh, sure. And on day one, that’s why I designed it. It was only four hours to get you dialed into the car and getting to know the routines- Yeah …

Emma Easter: and stuff. And know each other as well, which is quite important for you guys to chat amongst- For sure … yourselves so you can- You, you

David Sneath: might have met your colleague, but-

Emma Easter: Yeah

David Sneath: we don’t know who to put, put you with when you arrive. No, it’s got, you

Scott Brady: know. Yeah. You might have

David Sneath: had [00:24:00] an argument on a previous launch or

Scott Brady: something. No, it was, everything was great. You guys did a good job of curating the people that were there. They were all party souls. Ah. And they all, they all loved being in a bush camp.

Mm-hmm. And there was no com- there was no complaints that I heard. It seemed like everybody was, everybody was very, very happy, so.

David Sneath: And there’s no point in putting out your, your best opportunity for excitement on the first day.

Scott Brady: Yeah. ‘

David Sneath: Cause then you’ve got two days of what’s coming next. Yeah, sure. And I’m a bit sort of, “Oh, I’ve finished now.”

Scott Brady: Yeah,

David Sneath: sure. So I like to get it to slowly build all the way through. And even that trip back from Sesfontein back up to Epale yesterday afternoon- So fun.

Scott Brady: So fun.

David Sneath: You know, it is a long way on those dusty roads. But as Emma says, the communication across the car with the comms and the-

Emma Easter: It makes it fun.

David Sneath: Makes it fun.

Yeah.

Scott Brady: It’s a two-hour rally drive. I don’t know what you’re talking. Yeah. It was fantastic. It was fantastic. It was fantastic. Yes. No, no complaints at all. Yeah. I mean, it was wonderful.

David Sneath: And do you push on-

Scott Brady: Yeah …

David Sneath: to allow the more enthusiastic, capable [00:25:00] drivers? Sure. And but I’ve got to take the whole-

Scott Brady: Right

David Sneath: convoy with me. Uh, so yeah, it’s-

Scott Brady: No, it was, it was great.

David Sneath: It’s- With slight relief when you come in

Scott Brady: unscathed. We made it. Unscathed, intact. Yeah, for sure. Now, you have, since you’ve been with Land Rover for 40 years, you’ve probably owned a lot of Land Rover your- yourself. Do you have any idea how many Land Rovers you’ve personally owned?

David Sneath: Uh, obviously, hopefully my wife’s not listening. But, uh-

Scott Brady: Well, they were all free. Let’s go with that.

David Sneath: Well, she calls it my orphanage. So they find me. Yeah. They find me. So I mean, it’s, it’s probably over, over 40, I should think. Yeah, sure. I mean, over the full length of my career, but currently it’s, it’s only eight.

Scott Brady: How many… What are the Land Rovers you have now?

David Sneath: Uh, three Series 1s, Series II, Series III, Defender 90, uh, uh, two Range Rovers, a three-door and an

LSE.

Scott Brady: Oh, a three-door. Beautiful. Yeah. What year is your three-door?

David Sneath: My three-door is ’72.

Scott Brady: Oh, geez. Yeah, year of my birth.

David Sneath: [00:26:00] Yeah. And then, uh, I also have a, uh, a TVR. Everything’s got a V8 in it. That’s, that’s all that matters.

Scott Brady: That’s the one requirement?

David Sneath: That’s the one requirement.

Scott Brady: Oh, that’s nice. Now, so- In all of those years, what would you say is your favorite, your personal favorite Land Rover?

If for some reason you had, you could only own one. Let, let’s exclude the current models just to make it easier for you to-

David Sneath: That, that makes it a lot easier.

Scott Brady: Yeah.

David Sneath: I think for all-round capability, comfort, usability, look, feel, has to be my three-door classic Range Rover.

Scott Brady: Yeah, I agree with you

David Sneath: 100%. Uh, I mean, I love my Series trucks, but, but, you know, I know my wife and children would be quite happy to go on a massive journey in it because it’s comfortable, it’s roomy-

Scott Brady: Mm-hmm

David Sneath: it takes everything and-

Scott Brady: And they’re beautiful.

David Sneath: Yeah, and I’ve … I remember when they first came out, I w- I was at school, and a parent had bought one, and they brought it to the sort of end of term cricket match. And they had a [00:27:00] picnic out at the back, and that, it was a blue one, and that’s just ingrained in my brain.

Scott Brady: That blue was beautiful, too. Yeah. It was

David Sneath: so colorful. And I’ve always, always wanted one. And as soon as I could afford one, I bought one. I mean, it was a nail, but it was there.

Scott Brady: And then you restored it yourself.

David Sneath: Uh, no, not really. I sort of agree. It sort of, uh, we carried on and went off, you know, did boys things with it.

Sure. It, it, uh, didn’t survive that long, but I knew I had to get another one.

Scott Brady: Oh, okay. So- So that’s what you have now is- So

David Sneath: I’ve had the current one-

Scott Brady: Yeah …

David Sneath: probably about 12 years now.

Scott Brady: Oh, good for you. That’s wonderful. Yeah. And Emma, what’s your favorite Land Rover?

Emma Easter: Out of current range, uh, Range Rover Sport.

You like the Range Rover Sport. Uh, I think

Scott Brady: it’s a beautiful car. Which motor in that

Emma Easter: one? Really? It’s gotta be

Scott Brady: a supercharged V8.

Emma Easter: Yeah.

Scott Brady: What? Yeah. Who cares how much fuel- No … fuel it costs, right?

Emma Easter: Uh, yeah, it’s just a good-looking car. Yeah.

Scott Brady: Yeah. And of the older Land Rovers, which ones are your favorites?

Emma Easter: Oh, don’t know.

Probably the same as Dave. They’re just, just great cars.

Scott Brady: Yeah,

Emma Easter: they really are. And I haven’t driven a lot of the older range, [00:28:00] um, but we’ve done … We’ve got our classic center. That’s, uh- Sanity.

David Sneath: We did a drive for the 70th anniversary.

Emma Easter: Yeah.

David Sneath: Uh, which we, we were given the opportunity to go into both classic, uh, and heritage and get out.

Uh, it was like a sort of dream list, and we put all those together. Yeah. And we did a drive-

Emma Easter: It was, yeah …

David Sneath: for a number of journalists aro- around- Sure … Solihull and stuff. And I think it’s really important to- Take, uh, our new, uh, intake into the business through that lineage. So we have grads that come and- Mm-hmm

have placement from engineering with us, which is an old contact, and they come into our department, and they’ve never done anything like that before.

Emma Easter: It’s a whole another world to them.

David Sneath: Whole another world to them. But that’s, you know, once they’ve got their head around it, that, that we’ve left them with an experience for life, and they’re taking that back into engineering, and that’s all being fed back into the new cars.

Scott Brady: And you’ve been with Land Rover for so long that h- how do you feel that connection still to the past? Do you feel that throughout the organization, that [00:29:00] acknowledgement of the past? It sure seems like that Land Rover respects so much of its heritage.

David Sneath: Yes. I, I, I think you have to be very careful with it-

Scott Brady: Yeah

David Sneath: because, uh, you have to move on.

Scott Brady: Yeah.

David Sneath: And if we’re entrenched in the past, then we wouldn’t be alive, if that’s the right term- Sure … to use today.

Scott Brady: Yeah.

David Sneath: So you- you’ve gotta be cognizant of what’s happened in the past.

Scott Brady: Yeah. It wouldn’t even- But- … be legal to sell- … a Series I Discovery or a Series I- No … Land Rover today.

It wouldn’t even pass any of the safety requirements.

David Sneath: But also, you’d be ignorant if you didn’t look back at some of the excellent innovation that’s taken place and- Mm … uh, reevolve that into what you see today parked outside. Yeah, sure. That’s effectively what’s there. Yeah. Lots of learning-

Scott Brady: Sure …

David Sneath: and passion has gone into that new car.

Scott Brady: Mm.

David Sneath: Which is why it’s got this character.

Scott Brady: And what, what kind of advice would you give someone that was just about … They just recently bought a Land Rover, and they wanna go do a significant trip like this. What kind of advice would you [00:30:00] give them? What would be the first thing that you would tell someone if they came to you and said, “David, I just bought a new Defender and I wanna go to Namibia.”

What would be the first piece of advice you’d give them?

David Sneath: Research, read- You can’t just walk into a shop, buy it, and go and do it. Yeah. So it’s about preparation. So research, preparation, and that’s preparation of vehicle and people- Sure … as we talked about earlier in this podcast.

Scott Brady: Yeah, get some, get some training, et cetera.

Yeah.

David Sneath: And go and talk to a number of people. Don’t go to one perceived expert.

Scott Brady: Mm.

David Sneath: Uh, because they’ve got their own view and their own experiences. But if you look at the breadth of experience across the ride, there are many people that love to talk about things.

Scott Brady: Mm.

David Sneath: Um, but you, you’ve got to see people that have actually delivered.

Scott Brady: And they’ve done it. And those people that have done it. Yeah, that they’ve done it. And how about you, Emma? What, what advice would you give to someone that was planning their first trip? From the things that you’ve learned with Land Rover, what would you … What advice would you give people [00:31:00] around planning and logistics?

Emma Easter: I’d, I’d say preparation, again, is absolutely key. But you can plan, plan, plan, and things can still not go the way you want, want it to go. I mean, this is Africa . Right. Right. And things are gonna- Yes. Things are gonna come out, not work quite how you, you think in your head. So I think it’s all about staying pretty calm, not flapping or stressing, and I think that’s one of the key things I’ve learned, to just keep my cool and problem

Scott Brady: solve

Emma Easter: where

Scott Brady: you

Emma Easter: can.

Oh, that makes sense. Yeah. But things … Yeah, things aren’t gonna go always to, to how you, you dreamt they would be. But yeah, staying calm, problem solve, speaking to the team. I mean, we’ve got so many years of experience here, and I’m learning every day from the guys- Mm … I’m here with. So yeah, just keeping your cool.

Scott Brady: Yeah, that makes sense. I mean, we have to plan so that way we don’t invite too many problems. But once we start the trip, we have to just kind of let the rest of it go and [00:32:00] take it as it comes. Mm-hmm. Or else we become so obsessed with sticking to a plan or a certain outcome that we s- we forget- Yeah … to stop.

Emma Easter: And you’ll forget to enjoy it. Yeah, and enjoy it. If you’re thinking, “Oh, we’re late,” or, you know, “We didn’t go this way,” it’s, it’s not always gonna be perfect, but you never know what you might find on the way doing something else that could be even better, so.

Scott Brady: Like stopping in that little village and interacting with the locals and buying some bracelets, and- Yeah.

I mean, they were beautiful people, and that- Yeah … if we hadn’t stopped, we would have missed that rich moment.

Emma Easter: Yeah.

David Sneath: But that- that’s part of the journey. It is. So

Scott Brady: when

David Sneath: I ran into that place on my recces, I thought, “This is beautiful.”

Scott Brady: Yeah.

David Sneath: And a lot of people didn’t want to stop because, “Ooh, I, I’m, I’m concerned about interacting.”

And so you’ve got to encourage people to do that, to, to be brave and step outside their comfort, because then their journey becomes even richer. Um-

Scott Brady: Yeah, those memories …

David Sneath: and, and I think the key thing about coming to places like Africa, and it’s the same wherever you [00:33:00] go, is you’ve got to respect the local culture.

And it’s all about people connections.

Emma Easter: Mm.

David Sneath: Um, and so I spend a lot of time getting to know the local- Processes and talking to key players to make sure that what we’re trying to do is acceptable to them from a cultural point of view. ‘Cause, you know, big company like Land Rover coming into town, yes, okay, we’re putting a lot of, uh, income in, back in, ’cause that’s very important to us as well, but when we leave, we want them to invite us back.

Yeah. That, that’s a key, key thing for me.

Scott Brady: And y- yeah, and we all want them to have as positive a, of an experience as we have, and I think as tourists, oftentimes they can get this idea that they’re … And they don’t recognize it, but they’re really taking a lot. Mm-hmm. And they’re not giving as much back, so stopping and shaking someone’s

Emma Easter: hand- Like John was saying the other night- Yeah

that, you know, speak to these people because they, they want, they wanted to talk, interact with you.

Scott Brady: Yeah. It was really- Yeah … that [00:34:00] was really neat, just to stop and shake their hand, and smile, and, and interact with them, ask them how their day is- Mm … and things like that. That’s really special. But also with the truckies.

Yeah. You

David Sneath: know, I

Scott Brady: mean- We did that … we met

David Sneath: those other guys in the, in the gorge. Yeah. Uh, and they were just blown away.

Scott Brady: They loved it.

David Sneath: By, “What, what are you guys doing here?” Uh, so that’s … You’ve gotta build relationships.

Scott Brady: You do. ‘

David Sneath: Cause y- you then are able to get a lot more out of them, because they, they sort of relax, and they tell you about things, which then make it a richer experience for us as well.

Scott Brady: Yeah, so agree. David and Emma, thank you both so much for the time. I, I admire so much what you both do, and I was able to experience firsthand the results of your professionalism and your skills a- and many of the, not only the vehicles you’ve talked about, David, but the other trips, like G4 and everything else, were so formative to my passion, not only for Land Rover, but for vehicle-based travel, that I thank you and all of [00:35:00] those that have come before you that have done so much to inspire those of us that wanna go see the world.

So thank you both for your time this morning.

David Sneath: You’re welcome.

Emma Easter: Pleasure.

David Sneath: It’s been a pleasure. Yeah.

Scott Brady: Yeah. Thank you.

David Sneath: Thank you.