Canadians... What's it really like?

There is only one reason why I carry. Had a close encounter with a bear that decided to make it's way into my campsite one night. Came right up and sniffed/ scratched on my tent. Never seen my wife's eyes so wide in fear. A different time we were hiking with my Beagle and had a fox circle and then trail us pretty much all the way back to the trailhead. Neither time was there a Park Ranger, police officer, or Mountie anywhere near by. I have carried ever since.
I have close encounters with bears wandering through my garden. Welcome to Canada. Buy a plaid shirt, grown a beard. HTFU :)

(PS - Did you actually mean a fox? Like those cute little things?)
 

billiebob

Well-known member
Totally non political, I just wish Canada had more in common with these countries. Quite right, I have never fired a gun in 65 years. And I have never felt a gun would do anything but escalate a confrontation, human and animal.


But I'm not trying to validate the new legislation, just stating what I believe.
 

Ducstrom

Active member
That's the thing though. Nobody that owns these guns wants gun violence either. As soon as a tragedy like the one in Nova Scotia occurs it shines a huge spot light on firearms and the likely hood of more firearm regulation increases.
That guy had no firearm license and obtained the firearms he had through illegal means. No firearm regulation or ban in Canada would have stopped this tragedy.
I am trying to respect the forum rules and not get into the politics and will refrain from delving into how these new laws won't do anything to stop gun violence.

I worked in forestry in northern BC for several years and have had several close encounters with bears. I packed a pistol grip 12 guage pump action. I never had to shoot a bear with it, but did use it to scare them off several times. It gets unnerving when working alone remotely in the forest and a bear just keeps following you around. I sure felt a lot safer having the gun should the need arise.

I believe most firearm owners, myself included, use their firearms as tools or for recreational target shooting. It's fun to head to the range with your buddies and get a little competitive to see who can ring the gong! They can also be fun to accessorize with new stocks, optics, barrels, etc, etc to make them more accurate. I am sure regardless of your stance on guns everyone on this forum can agree accessorizing things is fun.

There needs to be more discussion around the subject and the understanding will follow. The sensationalized stereotype of gun owners the media spews is far from the truth in my experience.
 
That's the thing though. Nobody that owns these guns wants gun violence either. As soon as a tragedy like the one in Nova Scotia occurs it shines a huge spot light on firearms and the likely hood of more firearm regulation increases.
That guy had no firearm license and obtained the firearms he had through illegal means. No firearm regulation or ban in Canada would have stopped this tragedy.
I am trying to respect the forum rules and not get into the politics and will refrain from delving into how these new laws won't do anything to stop gun violence.

I worked in forestry in northern BC for several years and have had several close encounters with bears. I packed a pistol grip 12 guage pump action. I never had to shoot a bear with it, but did use it to scare them off several times. It gets unnerving when working alone remotely in the forest and a bear just keeps following you around. I sure felt a lot safer having the gun should the need arise.

I believe most firearm owners, myself included, use their firearms as tools or for recreational target shooting. It's fun to head to the range with your buddies and get a little competitive to see who can ring the gong! They can also be fun to accessorize with new stocks, optics, barrels, etc, etc to make them more accurate. I am sure regardless of your stance on guns everyone on this forum can agree accessorizing things is fun.

There needs to be more discussion around the subject and the understanding will follow. The sensationalized stereotype of gun owners the media spews is far from the truth in my experience.
//RANT ON//

Totally agree with you Ducstrom but responsible Canadian gun owners, of which I am also one, need to communicate with the rest of the country who do not share our interest in firearms. As you say "we" are nothing like the sensationalized caricatures presented in news reporting but our representatives (MPs, MLAs, activists etc) are not doing gun owners a solid. For example, instead of a methodical breakdown of the OIC vs. Statscan data we got a number of responses (attached in earlier conversations) by "representatives" that were as much hyperbole as the GoC's lead in to the OIC (they'll take our shotguns away!). Only once the petition was launched were coherent statements made.

I would say the question we should be asking ourselves is: why are Canadians not aware of the already strict regime gun owners must follow in Canada? Like the countries mentioned in billiebob's link we have similar requirements for training, thorough background checks, transportation and club requirements depending on what class of firearms you own. There are variances of course, but that likely has more to do with cultural and geographic influences (big watery bits all around your country or a nation with one of the lowest crime rates on the planet). That said, tragedies are still going to occur and the wrong people will get access to firearms. Norway has almost as many gun deaths as Canada (https://worldpopulationreview.com/countries/gun-deaths-by-country/). Australia, has half the suicides with firearms than Canada but it's overall suicide rate is higher (https://worldpopulationreview.com/countries/suicide-rate-by-country/). Norway has great social cohesion but an outcast by the name Anders Breivik still killed 77 with over 300 casualties in 2011. In my opinion, the single most effective thing the government did to control gun violence is implement mag capacity limits for rifles (unleash the hate if you must, I shoot pieces of paper so a 5 round mag is fine).

Ultimately, in my opinion a ban supporter is attempting to ensure safety (absence of fear) for Canadians. I mention absence of fear since our societies are polluted with overblown anxiety over just about everything. The easiest way to eliminate fear is to eliminate the threat. The design and style of certain weapons instill more fear than grandpa's old double barrel. Our populations are largely urban and isolated from any firearms culture (sport shooting or military). We live beside a firearms behemoth that experiences firearms tragedies frequently that are sensationalized by many media organizations. I don't blame non-gun owners (or non restricted/AR owners) for being anxious about firearms ownership in Canada.

Why do I want to shoot an AR-10 variant? Frankly modularity, convenience and cost are all consids. I can buy a semi-auto Stag-10 and target shoot at longer ranges to build my own skills, knowledge and patience with a semi-auto rifle. I'm soon to be ex-CAF so the ergonomics and layout are familiar and comfortable, I know the stoppage drills, and it is accurate enough to get results I'm looking for. I can also (or could) buy another upper with a different barrel/chamber and swap it on a standard AR-10 lower (also now banned..or that's how I read the dog's breakfast of that clearly rushed OIC) or I could drop some change south of the border at Uinta precision and buy a compatible bolt-action upper for the same rifle, this would've saved me money. As it stands the Browning BAR is about the only SA rifle left for longer range SA shooting and a nice one at that. Regardless, both SA rifles have the same mag restrictions at 5 rounds and will perform similarly in most civilian applications (including the illegal ones). Do I 'need' an AR-10 variant? No, I don't but if the government wants to ban and take any private property away they should should have to explain to Canadians their fact-based rationale via the House of Commons. Likewise, once that discussion, debate and vote in the HoC takes place and if the result is the same then I exchange my newly banned rifle in the buy-back program because it's the law. I don't have to like the law but I do have to abide by it.
 

Grassland

Well-known member
Well now shotguns are actually getting prohibited by this OIC, along with rifles suitable for dangerous game. Be interesting to see if the guys and gals who exclusively hunt waterfowl or shoot clays realize that they are in fact next in line to lose everything.
 

billiebob

Well-known member
Thing about Canada, millions of conspiracy theories out there. Thousands of naysayers. But in Canada, as the opposition says, if it proves to be duck hunters will have to will have to euthanize their retrievers, there will be a new government in 3 years or sooner. The naysayers swear they will reverse everything todays elected representatives have done. Regardless of any positive results. Personally I want to hear what the other plan is.......... So far the other plan is reverse all the good done by the other side. Same old, same old, all around the world. No plan, just trash it all. Hate to say it but the Conservative movement around the world is losing. And my whole family used to be committed Progressive Conservative voters.

Bring back the Progressive part, attitude, commitment, you will win again, and not with a minority. Canada and the USA take note, you need to change. The status quo is a stalemate.
 
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PPCLI_Jim

Adventurer
NON POLITICAL STATEMENT
I've been declared a criminal by my government , for merely owning a sporting firearm that was legal the day before. It's claimed for public safety, but the government doesn't have a majority or any support to speak of in the west. Failed to aim an OIC at criminals but rather an already well managed and regulated section of the population of Canada .
I've been given a 2 year amnesty to turn myself in and accept whatever punishment they give me. From seizure of my property to jailtime.

I did nearly 30 yrs in the CAF & bent knee to the queen .But now I'm the criminal without doing anything. THAT'S WHAT CANADA IS LIKE TODAY.
 
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PPCLI_Jim

Adventurer
Totally non political, I just wish Canada had more in common with these countries. Quite right, I have never fired a gun in 65 years. And I have never felt a gun would do anything but escalate a confrontation, human and animal.
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But I'm not trying to validate the new legislation, just stating what I believe.
I'm an ex military person been deployed a few times and I'll let you see what its like from the other side. AUS has moved the #s req for a shooting incident to declare it a mass shooting, yet still suffers from attacks. Britain suffers from mass knife/machete/baseball bat/acid attacks, Norway had their central secure lock up areas broken into and pillaged by the local crime syndicates.
I've been hunting and fishing since my young days. Did nearly 30 yrs service been deployed 5+ times been on the TIP of the spear few times and used a fire arm to defend lives , I've also used them to end lives. I know what a fire arm can do. It c an do absolutely nothing without a person , so why are we blaming a tool vs blaming the person? Oh yes it doesn't gain the headlines .

The biggest thing is if you don't want one fine , but don't think I have to let you tell me I cannot have one . Or maybe i could decide you need to only use a fork to eat soup to fight viruses that live on forks and knives, and see how that goes.
 
I should have pre-fixed the media organizations with Canadian media organizations. The recent government ban laid bare the level of general ignorance regarding Canadian firearm laws. The 24/7 coverage of firearms crimes in the US has an outsized influence on Canadian public opinion and that leads to a lot of misunderstanding. The anxiety around firearms is used to push agendas in spite of evidence to the contrary (https://www.theglobeandmail.com/canada/article-critics-question-ottawas-online-survey-that-found-strong-opposition/). That situation is evident when the ban doesn't cover the most commonly used firearm in crime - SA pistols sourced primarily from the USA or other "assault-style" rifles left alone (IWI, M+M, etc.).

On the other hand, Canadian firearms owners do themselves no favours by trying to frame the argument on indivdual rights (firearms/property) or home defence. There is no right to firearms in Canada and statements to that effect are easily exploited by anti-firearms activists. Property rights is (whether you agree with it or not) never going to win over individual safety in Canada. Home defence is also easily exploited since there are no castle laws in Canada and the level of violent crimes and burglary have been dropping since 2000 (yes there has been a slight uptick in the last few years but burglaries are down by almost half).

I will say though that I originally had no problem with with the high energy weapons ban. I didn't think a 50 BMG rifle was a firearm any civilian should own (again, my opinion). However, indigenous hunters use 50 BMG to go after big animals like caribou and muskox. This is a legit use of the rifle and cartridge i.e. better standoff and safety so I changed my position on 50 BMG (or any other high energy rounds).

The debate is no closer to conclusion up here, whether that's in my mind or the Canadian population. Now to pick up a non-AR carbine before those get banned too.
 

billiebob

Well-known member
don't think I have to let you tell me I cannot have one
oh no, not me, but when your government bans them, well ......

My post was about looking at countries with less gun crime than us. And learning from that.
But if want to be the guy blindly defending his right to carry and use an assault rifle, be that guy, Thankfully Canada is a democracy.
In a dark alley, a guy with a gun or a guy with a knife, I'd sooner square off with the guy holding the knife, even if I were unarmed.
 
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