Which off-road vehicle?

[Ari3sgr3gg0]

I might be a bit biased but why not a Suburban? Get them in the square body style on you get solid axles, the drivetrain is pretty solid. It can seat four easy, without a third row you get an enclosed truck bed that can haul all kinds of tools. If you want more mpg find the diesel versions or if that isn't a concern just get the reliable Chevy 350. To echo everyone else, you already have the Xterra which does what you want. It has 200k+ miles and is 13 years old, so what if it gets some dings and scratches? You own it and probably know it's quirks inside and out, that is a big value in itself

 

[Heading Out]

The full size rig ideas are great BUT go back and look at the first post, this is something to replace a small Toyota 4x4 truck, to be used IN THE WOODS.

I have had a series of small Japanese 4x4 pick-ups before my current YJ, and even the Jeep is large (Wide) compared the small pick ups when you get it into tight over grown trails, but the turning radius is smaller and it goes places in 2wd the trucks needed 4wd to go, plus, so many options for hard top, soft top, no top, and tons of aftermarket support for mods. when/if you feel like it.

Yes, you have the Xterra and it would also be a good starting point, but, you also stated it was still too nice to beat up, and if it is sold the $$ will go into the wife's CJ.
I still say get a Wrangler, have some fun with it, the wife will want the CJ restored in no time.

 

[Needin'Advice]

I will try to address as many posts as possible, but first, thank you all for your input and ideas. It really is helpful. Also, I should have mentioned that this is not a project that will be happening right away, so I have time to debate things and keep my eyes open for deals.

I love the suburban idea, but its way to big for what I and the neighbors have as trails. They are 4 wheeler paths that were widened to fit side by sides as a few people got them. It would take a lot of work to make the suburban (or power wagon) friendly. Actually, my first post here was asking for square body purchasing advice, but decided to fix up the Duramax I already have.

Side note: the Silverado has new rockers and cab corners, new tailgate, I am very slowly building a new rear bumper. I replaced all 4 corners as far as brakes go. That is all due to Mi and Oh rust. I also put some new rims and tires on it and am now debating some suspension upgrades, and trying to plan a roof rack design that I will attempt to fab up. There are alot of other problems that need addressed as well (power windows, seat controls, windshield leak, (I think. The drivers floor boards get very wet when it rains)).

The "work with what you already own" idea seems to be working out in that context, so it certianly sticks in my mind here as well. We do know the Xterra well, although there isn't a whole lot to know, it has been basically trouble free (knock on wood). In reality, it probably is worth more to us than we can sell it for. The ifs doesn't really concern me in the short run, but on the (slim) chance we get into offroading a lot more, it might be a limiting factor. Although, a SAS might be a fun undertaking someday as my skills improve. I will absolutley look more into the Lokka. I had never even heard of that. Were you referring to that up front and leaving the rear end open, or throwing a locker out back, too? And there's still the uneasy feeling of putting a relatively nice vehicle into a tree.

The xj has a lot of appeal and there are certainly some cheap one available. Most cheap ones are pretty rusted though. The ones without the rust aren't cheap. I know cheap is a relative term. Rusted ones with 200k miles can be had for under $1k. Nice ones without the rust with around 150k can be upward of 4k. Mild built ones that are a little(or a lot) beat up look to be around $2500 and up. In that case, I very well might be just inheriting someone else's problems. I don't mind some rust if I am going to beat out up anyway, but at what point does it impact the unibody strength?

Wranglers are a cool option, but the last time I checked them out, people wanted an arm and a leg for them. Also, I can't help wonder why I would get one, when we already have CJ sitting here (just thinking out loud, by no means criticizing your opinion). Is there that big of a difference between them to justify having both. I know, we can always justify more vehicles!!

Samurai's are cool, but definitly harder to find and more expensive. The small size would work great in the woods, but might force the rear seat to go in and out based on family ride vs. doing work around the property.

Downfall of all of these is no bed, but I can probably deal with that. The Xterra still has storage room behind the rear seats. I did see some pics of xjs turned into trucks. A few of them were pretty amazing.

The more I think about it, the more I don't think the CJ will ever be a woods vehicle. It might have the look, but in reality it will be more of a "mall crawler". I hate to do that to a vehicle, but it really is the most likely course of action. Plus my wife made a comment once about it being my boys' first ride, 12 years from now. She has been wanting me to start on it for a while, but other things always seem to pop up in its place.

I am sure I am missing some ideas that were addressed, but I really do appreciate all the input. I might jump over to the Nissan forum and see what those guys are doing to their Xterras.

I will research and debate forever, and even then, I will pull the trigger slower than anyone you have ever known. It's a curse...dated my wife for 14 years before getting married...just had to make sure I guess!

Thanks again.

 

[daddyusmaximus]

There is only one 4x4 that screams America...



Fix up the Jeep, and don't be affraid of a little tree branch pinstriping.

 

[JakeH]

With regard to the lokka I think they probably have a model for either axle, but I was referring to rear. I havent priced them but without the electrical & air you may be able to lock both axles for the same cost as a single air powered ARB. There are plenty of heavily modified xterra out there to drool over. Plenty of sliders & bumpers available to keep you off the trees too

 

[MOguy]

Unless you are hauling only a couple sticks eventually hauling fire wood will beat up whatever you put it in no matter how care full you are.

Can you use a cargo Trailer to haul your wood? You should be able to pick one up for a couple hundred dollars. A trailer can give you allot of extra space when you need it but when you don't you can leave it behind and are stuck with a vehicle bigger than you need.

If trails are tight a wrangler or unlimited wrangler (longer than regular wrangler) are great options but like you said they can be pricey. The reason wranglers are pricey is because they are worth it. Unless space is an issue a wrangler is hard to beat. Great off road ability and the top comes off. XJ and other Jeep SUVS are uni body. I wouldn't consider an older uni body anything if you are in an area rust could be an issue.

If you are on really rough trails solid axles have advantages. If they aren't two rough than IFS is OK. Solid axle vehicles are easier to lift and maintain if your vehicle will be on rough trails.

Could a smaller 4 door pickup work for you?

 

[04Ram2500Hemi]

The 3G came out in 2005. That is what I own and is probably best of breed in modern PWs. In 2006 they went to the canbus electronics, some advantages for a street machine, but the usual computer downsides for everything else. I think the 3G went to about 2010 or so, with minor upgrades in power and creature comforts. The 4G got a longer cab and is larger overall, nicer truck on the highway but less nimble offroad. Re locking the rears, the PWs all have LSD rears plus factory lockers on both solid axles, plus the big Warn winch. Just about all PWs can fit 35" tires on stock wheels with no other mods, and most of the 3Gs can fit 37s with no or minimal mods. The PW is not only better than "pretty good out of the box," it is astoundingly good out of the box and can be easily modded to do anything a truck ever needs to do. And the back seat will hold the boys when they are teenagers. And you can carry a chainsaw and a lot of firewood in the bed.

I'm with Ducky- a 3rd Gen Power Wagon would be a great vehicle for you. I love my 2012 Power Wagon, but I'll agree the 3rd gens are going to be more nimble and have better visibility than my 4th gen Wagon. Think of it as the Jeep Rubicon's big brother.

 

[kojackJKU]

I think your reading to much on the internet. solid vs. IFS is moot for off roading at this point if you are not hammering rocks all the time. I used to be (that vehicle sucks because it does not have a Solid front axle). Now I am damn the vehicle sucks because it has a solid front axle. Yeah, you can lift them on the cheap, but ride comfort, control, and overall ground clearance SUCKS with them. I have moved on from solid axles. Have a look at the mulitiude of 4runners, tacomas and full size rigs rolling around the world with NO ISSUE. I laugh at all the reports of I am swapping out to a solid axle posts. WHY. There is nothing wrong with IFS....unless your bouncing around on bolders going nowhere all day. Then yeah, SOLID is for you.

 

[millerfish]

I agree with kojack! IFS is actually a better choice if you are not rock crawling or wanting to build a monster truck. For me the Tacoma is the best choice. Gen 1 if you want that mini truck size but the get 2 will be much more comfortable as the boys grow.

 

[MOguy]

I think your reading to much on the internet. solid vs. IFS is moot for off roading at this point if you are not hammering rocks all the time. I used to be (that vehicle sucks because it does not have a Solid front axle). Now I am damn the vehicle sucks because it has a solid front axle. Yeah, you can lift them on the cheap, but ride comfort, control, and overall ground clearance SUCKS with them. I have moved on from solid axles. Have a look at the mulitiude of 4runners, tacomas and full size rigs rolling around the world with NO ISSUE. I laugh at all the reports of I am swapping out to a solid axle posts. WHY. There is nothing wrong with IFS....unless your bouncing around on bolders going nowhere all day. Then yeah, SOLID is for you.

I'm going to disagree with you about ground clearance with ifs vs. Solid axle. With solid axle your lowest point always stays in the same place and is determined by the size of your different and tires. It is predictable. With independent suspension it changes and come closer to the ground do as you suspension compresses. This is advantageous for even moderate off roading.

Each system has its benefits and drawbacks. As far as ride? My 2001 grand Cherokee with solid axles rode much better than my 4Runner with IFS.

I have two Toyota with IFS, I have spent years drive I got hummers. I have a one ton 4x4 and a jeep wrangler with solid axle. I prefer the solid axle for maintaining, modifying and going off road.

As far as over landing it is really hard to find as newer vehicles with the space that is nice enough to have that aren't IFS.

 

[Happy Joe]

I'll chime in on the IFS vs. straight axle debate with some OPINION (and we all know what this is worth) based on real world off roading, ranging from dirt roads to moderately difficult (haven't tried IFS in any thing hard (high danger of body damage) yet, due to the small tires (255 70R 16) on the explorer).
Stock, open differential, IFS, seems, limited off road until/unless it is equipped with lockers and or a good traction control system; due to its design limited travel. It seems much easier to lift a tire with IFS w/ front & rear anti sway bars (note; not all straight axle vehicles have adequate front wheel travel either, and the same thing applies to those) lift a tire without a traction aiding differential/ traction system, and all traction from that axle is lost and forward progress often stops.
Mods to increase wheel travel, or to lift the vehicle for larger tires (ground clearance) seem to be, much easier and cheaper for straight axle vehicles.
Front end alignments seem to be required less often with straight axle vehicles (IFS at least in my case has needed more service even though abused less off road; although, in fairness, part of this could be working the bugs out of a newer, to me, vehicle).
Looking at aftermarket locker support for my DANA/Ford IFS it is much more limited than for any Dana straight axle that I have had in the past (not that big of a deal I expect that some light machine work can take care of it).
Looking at changing the differential gears & carrier the IFS looks like the labor will be significantly more.
For well maintained and designed systems I find little significant ride difference-no preference... Note; poorly modded (stiffly sprung) suspensions, likely all ride bad (used to really appreciate lateral acceleration).
For moderate rocks IFS seems a bit harder to keep from dragging (possibly a driver issue/what you are most used to, IMO).
I don't do high speed off road so cannot offer a comparison there.
Freeway performance so far is equivalent (handling and ride)...getting old so I limit my top speeds to 90mph or less on the interstate.

My verdict; for a grocery getter/on road vehicle; no difference.
for a vehicle actually used off road I (so far) prefer a straight front axle, due to its greater modification versatility/availability.

Enjoy!

 

[MOguy]

One HUGE advantage with straight axle vs independent is when one wheel is pushed up with solid axle it pushes down the opposite side forcing it to stay in better contact with the ground, This is better for traction. That doesn't happen with independent suspension. But this is why independent suspension should be able to offer a more comfortable ride because one side doesn't influence the other.

 

[Clutch]

 

[kojackJKU]

Yes please Clutch!

 

[Ducky's Dad]

IFS vs solid axle depends on the vehicle. GM IFS 1/2 ton axles have notoriously weak diffs and shafts, so are not very good candidates for front lockers, but are good candidates for axle swaps. My Dodge with solid axles is just as comfortable on the road as my IFS GMC and Tundra, but way more capable offroad, so for me that makes it a better all-around truck. The GMC is my work-truck beater, and the Tundra is my street truck, so it all works out. All are 4WD, but the Dodge is the one I would drive if I could have only one.