Where do I start (Land Crusier guy considering Rover)

Butch1979

Family Adventurer
Hello fellow overlanders

I'm thinking about coming over to the Land Rover side of the house and would like to know where I should start reading up on the quirks of the different years.

I'm leaning towards an LR3, but I'm open to suggestions... Any certain Discoveries that are worth building?

Am I kidding myself on the lower initial price of an LR3 compared to a Land Cruiser? Will I end up spending it all on maintenance?

Cheers

Butch
 

dwvninety

Observer
Maintenance is going to cost you a lot more. Nice vehicle to wheel in and very capable, you might want to read up on some LR3 and Discovery forums.
 

zelatore

Explorer
I don't know how much it costs to own a Cruiser so it's hard to say what the differences might be.
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In general you're unlikely to have any mechanical issues with the powertrain on the LR3. It's very robust. It's weak points are the air suspension and the complex electronics. The single most expensive component that generally can (will?) fail is the suspension compressor. Figure about $1000 from a dealer, $800 on-line, or for about $120 you can buy a kit to rebuild it yourself in a couple hours.
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If you're really paranoid about the air suspension, Atlantic British will sell you a coil conversion kit for about a grand. You'll loose the cool self-leveling and adjustable ride height but it should have zero issues and works with all the OEM computers.
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As for the electronics, add the cost of a GAP IId tool to your purchase price - it's well worth it to sort out codes and do your own troubleshooting or to work on the suspension (set heights, instant 'lift kit', work around a failed component in the field, etc) Figure about $400 for the non blue-tooth version, $600 for blue-tooth, at least as far as I recall. You can check prices at Lucky8, a site sponsor.
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In technical terrain they are pretty amazing but are limited by how much tire you can run. The biggest reasonable tire you'll get on will be a 275/65-18 on a stock SE model 18" wheel. Most people actually run a 265/65 as it requires a bit less trimming to make it fit. the 275 works out to approx. 32" fwiw.
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You can lift the truck very easily/cheaply. The GAP tool mentioned above will let you reset the height, but maybe not as much as you want. The other thing you can do is replace the ride height sensor link rods with parts from Green Oval or Johnson Rods (again, see Lucky8). These will basically make the 'standard' height the equivalent of the stock 'off road' height. Or about 2.5" of lift.
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Aftermarket support is limited. More than anything, I'd recommend a good set of rock sliders before heading to anything tough. I'm a big fan of the Tactical Rovers sliders as they offer maximum protection. I also run their gas tank and transfer case skids and have landed the full weight of the truck on them multiple times. (I run mine a bit harder than most) ARB is the go-to front bumper, though they do stick out a bit and actually hinder approach angles slightly. Tactical also makes one, but I don't really like the look of it. You can get hidden mounts for a winch that will fit behind the stock bumper, though access is pretty tight. If you upsize the tires to 275s, you won't be able to fit a spare in the stock under-car location so you'll need to either add a tire carrier, put it inside the truck (not great) or add a roof rack (several options) and chuck it up on top (also not good due to high COG and wind drag). Rear bumpers/tire carriers are very limited. Kaymar and Tactical are about it, and Kaymar is going to set you back maybe $3500 by the time you ship it in with options. I custom-built mine based sort of on the looks of the Tactical unit but with some changes I wanted and welded it on.
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The stock traction control systems are very good. There is the option of a rear locker with the HD package, but it can be hard to find as most people didn't order them that way. If you're not rock crawling the stock TC will likely do just fine without the locker. There is no manual control of the center (all) or rear (HD pkg) lockers - you get what the computer wants. There is no OEM front locker, but again unless you really push it you won't need it. Once or twice I've wished for one, but as I mentioned I tend to push mine more than average. ARB allegedly sells a locker but I've never actually seen one in the wild so do your research first if you think you'd want to go that way.
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They are quite heavy trucks - mine weighs in over 7100 lbs loaded without people. I do have a lot of armor but even stock they are heavy. Power is adequate for the weight, but they're no rockets. With my 32" Duratracs I can get about 15-16 mpg highway and 10-12 mpg city. Both will be better with less aggressive tires or less weight of course. I don't recall what I got with it stock as that was a while ago and I started mod'ing as soon as I got it.
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Figure on a semi-aggressive maintenance schedule and find a truck with good records and you should be good to go. If you want a 'drive it an forget it' sort of rig, maybe stay with the 'yota. Rovers are very much love em or hate em. Most fall in love with them, but even the newer trucks like this do ask a bit from you compared to a Camry. Still, there's something special about them.
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Lastly, find a good Rover club in your area and hook up with them. The people really make the experience.
 

Butch1979

Family Adventurer
Awesome replies! Thank you for taking the time to provide me some places to start doing some research. I'm definitely intrigued by the Land Rover. I really like the look of them and the mystique they have is undeniable. I will say that I'm terrified of the horror stories of questionable reliability.

What about Discovery IIs vs LR3s... it seems that you can find a Disco for CRAZY cheap these days.

Thanks again, keep the advice coming.

Butch
 
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roverandom

Adventurer
The dismal reliability reputation of the Discovery II in North America is why Land Rover decided to call the successor LR3 and not Discovery 3 (as it was named everywhere else) to distance it from the previous model.

That about sums it up.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

nwoods

Expedition Leader
If you read carefully, the vast majority of negative comments you'll read about the LR3 are from people who have not owned them, and have only owned older Rovers, or other makes altogether. The fearmongers among the LR community about the vulnerabilities of these "rolling computers" just hasn't withstood the test of time. The LR3/RRS platform is SIGNIFICANTLY more reliable than all the previous rovers put together.

The LR3's have a few known issues, as do all vehicles. But none of them are a big deal. The most hassle prone issue is premature wear of the suspension bushings, which costs about $250 a corner to replace the a-arms (which is usually easier than pushing out the bushings and replacing them). Plan on getting better tires, plan on getting the GAP tool, plan on replacing the bushings at some point, and then enjoy one of the most versatile and pleasurable vehicles you've ever owned.

Having said that, I really like the 100 series Land Cruisers. But they drive COMPLETELY differently than the LR3. They are night and day different on the road and on the trail. Compare them both and figure out which one you want to spend more time in. The LR3 will be hit the maintainance budget a bit more than the Cruiser, but not outlandishly.
 

mpinco

Expedition Leader
Having a 1978 FJ40 is similar to my path from a 1975 Scout. I moved to a 98 Discovery I and then LR4. Basically tractor to very capable SUV. Go for a 2008/9 LR3 or 11/12/13 LR4 with rear locker.
 

rlynch356

Defyota
my LR3 was great - should have kept it... (5yrs and 90k miles on it when sold)
IMHO.. I'd rather have a cruiser with non-airbag suspension and easier to maintain..

FYI.. also owned, Disco , Disco II, pass on both if you can, some years were good, a lot weren't) unless your building a dedicated machine for trails.

over on the cruiser side of the house I had a62 series, an 80 series, a 100 series, and a 40 series (this was a toy with low miles and basically stock), the FJcruiser and now the 200 series.

the cruisers were hands down better with the 80 and 100 series i owned from new doing 150k miles before i sold them.


lr3"s are good though just have eyes open to what breaks
 

Butch1979

Family Adventurer
So stay away from Disco IIs is what I'm hearing... I'm assuming you get what you pay for in this scenario. I see lots of cheap Disco IIs, but it appears they are not likely worth the risk.

I'm pretty excited about an LR3. I've been a die hard Cruiser guy for decades, this might be an interesting shift.

Cheers

Butch
 

stevehs

New member
I have to agree with the majority of the replies, LR3-LR4 are great possibilities. I have owned several Land Cruisers, Jeeps and 6 Land Rovers, 3 RR Classics, 1 D90, 1 Disco II, (2004) and now a 2012 LR4. I guess I have been very fortunate, I have had very good "luck" with all of them. My '95 RRC was my favorite for 13 years...I used it hard and it never left me stranded. The Defender was also fun, but not so comfortable! The '04 Disco was also very reliable, however, I got scared away with the "promise" of catastrophic engine failure. I went looking and ended up with a 2012 LR4. With all the years and miles, (and a lot of off-road use), my favorite hands down is the LR4. We were invited by our dealer to go to Moab for an offroad dealer trip. With a totally stock vehicle, I was blown away with the performance on and off road. I was seriously considering a new Jeep Rubicon right before the trip but decided that while the Jeep may be better in the technical and really narlly stuff, the LR4 will do everything I want it to. Hope this helps.
 

rlynch356

Defyota
LR3/4's are great.. Things to watch out for/prepare for anyway..

Suspension Air pumps go out ~ 100k miles or sooner. Part is $750ish, installed is normally $1,300 or so but is DIY able.
Air struts sometimes leak, either replace for convert to coils $1,000 from Atlantic British.

Buy one from 2006 on, they have the newer Jag based motor and are generally more reliable. (Mine was an 08'), before that the BMW based motors had some issues.

LR4's have a better terrain response system, if you can find one with the locker and HD option that would be perfect (but rare)
 

Jwestpro

Explorer
My lr3 is just under 100,000 miles this week. My extended warranty runs out at 100,000 or end of this year. I've had it cover around $14,000 in repairs in the last 50,000 miles / 3 years. I've never been stranded, but I do know my service guy way better than I had anticipated.... just this winter the rear side doors started to not lock when the vehicle was "locked". Sometimes when the starter key is turned, the vehicle is 100% quiet... try another time or two and it starts. Awesome.

I've never heard of such goofy stuff on a Land Cruiser. What's it all worth? Everyone has different priorities ;)
 

danrhiggins

New member
I had a 100-series LC for a number of years. I loved that truck. Went away from it when we became empty nesters and "downsized" to a small Lexus SUV. Over time I regretted no longer having the off-road option - especially as we began wanting to explore Colorado and beyond. I foolishly tried to fix this by moving to an Acura MDX. Wrong move. People would ask me about it and I would always say, "the vehicle I really want is to go back to a Land Cruiser". So a little over a year ago I began seriously researching the Land Cruiser option. The 200 series didn't "feel" the same to me. And I was also a bit disappointed that they hadn't improved their use of interior space - in the cargo area and with the rear seating - as other makers had. Still, I've always trusted the relative reliability of Toyota and I didn't see another option. Until I began researching Land Rover - sort of on a whim. The versatility and capability combined with just enough luxury and highway ride comfort had me hooked. But would it be reliable? Would I regret not going with a LC (or LX570) after wishing for one for many years. So I spent hours on the internet reading forums and watching videos of both going off-road. I spent hours at the Land Rover dealer configuring the cargo area every which way, sitting in it for extended periods (on the showroom floor), sitting in the driver and passenger seat and trying to imagine what I would dislike after owning it for a while. I would play with the controls. Then I would go to the nearby Toyota dealer and do the same thing with the LC. Then to the LX dealer. Finally I started doing test drives. Over time the efficient and versatile functionality of the LR4 along with the sense that it was a great vehicle for exploring (big windows, "alpine roof", variable height, etc. won me over so I ordered the LR4. 4 month wait. I had the option of changing my mind and getting my deposit back. And during those 4 months I fretted and fretted. Reliability was the biggest concern. I took the LR4 on a day long test drive - not only driving it but working from it. Still loved the way it drove and the way I could use it. But would it be reliable? A person on one of the other forums had also picked up a MY14 and was having significant issues - eventually going through the lemon law process to get rid of it. Argh! I was freaking out. 2 weeks before delivery I was still going back to the Toyota dealership. I did a couple more LC test drives. In general the drive was very good. But it just felt "bloated". I couldn't get past the poor ratio of internal space and versatility/utility to exterior dimensions. I stuck with my LR order.

And we could not be happier. It has only been a year and 28K miles. No issues at all. And the things we have been able to do have been amazing. Now every time I look at an LC I am reminded at how close I came to making what would have been a mistake for us. Maybe the LC will prove to be a better vehicle after 200K miles. But I will enjoy those first 200K miles so very much more. Maybe I will need to put an additional $10K into the LR than I would have had to with the LC, but the price of the LC was already $15K more than what I paid for the LR. And though there are those individuals who have had issues - and it pains me to see what they have to go through - I have read of many cases where the LR4 is doing great. And it has been great for us.

We did get the extended warranty which wasn't cheap but was much less than the difference in price for the more expensive LC. (We got a HSE LUX w/ vision assist, extended leather, ladder, rails, trailer package, etc. and it was still more than $10K less than the LC.) To be honest, if I need to put another $20K into the LR to replace and repair and keep it going for 200K miles I am good with that. Unless someone comes along with something better I will make this one last as long as possible.

And the versatility of the cargo area has been even more useful than I had imagined it would be. From camping out of the back (I could go on and on about this) to using it as a space to change clothes and prep my gear for mountain biking, hiking, show shoeing and photography, to using it as an occasional "virtual office". To driving on 4x4 trails that I would never have imagined with no mods other than doing different wheels/tires to reduce the chance of a flat and a bit more traction. Again, for us, this was an amazing choice and now it is about getting the most out of it. Summer is coming to Colorado and I can hardly wait to get out on the trails and back roads.

I have attached some photos to show some of what I mean by the versatility of the interior space.
 

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Butch1979

Family Adventurer
Gentlemen

Thanks a ton for all the great information! I know that some of this data was likely a repeat. I was over my trepidations and hunting for a nice LR4 when out of the blue a REALLY nice built 100 series LC showed up.

I've purchased another hundo, but will keep the LR4 in mind for future builds.

See you guys on the trail

Butch
 

Jwestpro

Explorer
Gentlemen

Thanks a ton for all the great information! I know that some of this data was likely a repeat. I was over my trepidations and hunting for a nice LR4 when out of the blue a REALLY nice built 100 series LC showed up.

I've purchased another hundo, but will keep the LR4 in mind for future builds.

See you guys on the trail

Butch

so what thread can we see it in ....????? :)
 

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