What will happen sooner... a Ford Gas vs Diesel dilema

CappyJax

Member
What year F550(chassis-cab) are you looking at? And what wheelbase?
For '19 at least, the F550 came with the aft-of-axle 40gal tank which all chassis cab's get. A diesel truck, only in XL or XLT trim(unsure why they didn't allow a Lariat trim get this "65C" option), could add the mid-ship 26.5gal tank, as seen on pg11 here;
Dual Diesel – combines 40 gallon aft-of-axle & 26.5 gallon mid ship tank (req. DRW; XL req. 96V XL Value Pkg. or 585 Radio on XL Fleet units)

Also note from pg3;
  1. Diesel Exhaust Fluid (DEF) Tank Location:
    • ○ Aft-of-axle fuel tank is paired with the DEF tank located in the mid ship location, between the frame rails.
    • ○ Mid ship fuel tank is paired with the DEF tank located outside of the frame rail
    • ○ Dual tanks are paired with the DEF tank located outside of
      the frame rail
Now, switching to pickup trucks, an F450 pickup (6.7L diesel only for F450) with a 176"WB (DRW only) could have a 48gal. See pg5;
So you could probably add the 40gal to it = 88gal total.
I cannot find any dual tank option for the '17-19 Ford SuperDuty pickups, only chassis cabs.

So, here's a rabbit hole....
#1 On your F550 project, if it was a '17-19 F550 chassis cab, and the 6.8L V10 (so no DEF tank in the way), it'd have the 40gal aft tank, but the rig would be a 179.8"WB SuperCrew (crew/quad cab) DRW (https://fordbbas.com/vehicleModel/SuperDuty) vs a 176"WB...which means MAYBE you can fudge in the pickup's 48gal midship tank into the chassis cab = 88gal, but who knows if the tank would fit well.
#2 As mentioned above, an F450 pickup (crew cab only, DRW only) is only available with the 6.7L diesel, it is 176"WB with the standard 48gal midship tank (they must fit the DEF tank somewhere around it?), and then you can probably add the chassis-cab's 40gal aft tank in place of the spare tire. This is probably your best bet = 88gal total capacity.
#3 Or this is also interesting, see this thread; https://expeditionportal.com/forum/...la-for-overlanding.222950/page-5#post-2898045 Titan's 55gal midship for '17-21 F250/350 SuperCrew(crew/quad cab) pickup, w/ 6.5' bed(I think Titan means 6.75' bed, as you can't get a 6.5' bed in '19 F-SD pickup), w/ 6.7L diesel. Now, per pg5 here (https://media.ford.com/content/dam/fordmedia/North America/US/product/2019/super-duty/2019-Super-Duty-Pick-Up-Order-Guide.pdf), an F250/350 pickup w/ 6.7L diesel would either come with a 29gal (142" or 148"WB) or a 34gal (160" or 164"WB). But Titan mentions the 34gal being the stock size, so this means if you got a '17-19 159.8"WB(would be a CrewCab in SRW or DRW, 4x2 or 4x4) or 164.2"WB(would be a SuperCab in SRW or DRW, 4x2 or 4x4) pickup...but wait, dammit, remember that the F450 pickup only comes in CrewCab DRW w/ 176"WB (4x2 or 4x4), which means 48gal tank as standard from Ford. And Ford doesn't make an F550 pickup, only chassis cab, so no possibility of an F550 w/ ~160" or ~164"WB in order to get the Titan55gal + Ford40gal = 95gal setup.

So, for an F450/F550, probably no way to do a 55gal midship from Titan + factory Ford 40gal aft tank = 95gal total capacity. Someone could do probably this with the F250 or F350 6.7L CrewCab pickup w/ 6.75' bed though!! Would reduce the rest of your payload capacity with all of that fuel.
Or, for the F450 crew cab pickup DRW w/ 176"WB, see #2 for 88gal diesel capacity.
F550 (available in any of 3 cab designs) w/ 6.7L diesel will be factory dual only (26.5gal midship and 40gal aft) = 66.5gal.

Whew that was a lot of data.
I am planning on buying new. So 2021, or more likely a 2022 by the time I finish the camper. It will be a 203 inch wheelbase chassis cab, so plenty of space for a midship tank. It would just be a matter of determining if the 48 gallon midship tank from the long bed pickups fits properly.

Diesel isn't a concern as there are so many after market tanks available. But I want to avoid the diesel if possible.
 

mk216v

Der Chef der Fahrzeuge
I am planning on buying new. So 2021, or more likely a 2022 by the time I finish the camper. It will be a 203 inch wheelbase chassis cab, so plenty of space for a midship tank. It would just be a matter of determining if the 48 gallon midship tank from the long bed pickups fits properly.

Diesel isn't a concern as there are so many after market tanks available. But I want to avoid the diesel if possible.
Jeebus, a 203"WB? Taking along a basketball team? ;)
With that much room, I'm sure the Ford 48gal can be made to fit.

I haven't looked for 2021MY; your 203"WB F550 petrol would be 7.3L Godzilla and 10spd, crew cab?...they offer that configuration vs diesel only for the 203"WB?
 

CappyJax

Member
Jeebus, a 203"WB? Taking along a basketball team? ;)
With that much room, I'm sure the Ford 48gal can be made to fit.

I haven't looked for 2021MY; your 203"WB F550 petrol would be 7.3L Godzilla and 10spd, crew cab?...they offer that configuration vs diesel only for the 203"WB?
Yes, Crew Cab, 10 speed, Godzilla. It will be an Earth Roamer sized (14ft floor) camper for about 1/3rd the price. I am designing it for living full time and indefinite boon docking. 4,500W+ of solar, grey water recycling system, rains water collection, 40kWh or battery, 10kW of inverters, all electric, but will a gas Espar hydronic heater for when it gets really cold. My ultimate goal is to put it on an electric F550 whenever they make one with sufficient battery capacity.

I could get the diesel in that configuration, I just don't want diesel. I always considered diesels better because of reliability and gas mileage, but the reliability is much worse than gas engines now because of all the emissions stuff. And the gas mileage advantage keeps decreasing as well. There is also the challenge of finding ULSD outside Canada and the US. Plus, you can't idle the new diesels without plugging up the particulate filter, but new gas engines no longer have the concern of washing the cylinder walls, so you can idle them without concern. This is important because I will have an underhood generator as a backup.
 

Watt maker

Active member
Yes, Crew Cab, 10 speed, Godzilla. It will be an Earth Roamer sized (14ft floor) camper for about 1/3rd the price. I am designing it for living full time and indefinite boon docking. 4,500W+ of solar, grey water recycling system, rains water collection, 40kWh or battery, 10kW of inverters, all electric, but will a gas Espar hydronic heater for when it gets really cold. My ultimate goal is to put it on an electric F550 whenever they make one with sufficient battery capacity.

I could get the diesel in that configuration, I just don't want diesel. I always considered diesels better because of reliability and gas mileage, but the reliability is much worse than gas engines now because of all the emissions stuff. And the gas mileage advantage keeps decreasing as well. There is also the challenge of finding ULSD outside Canada and the US. Plus, you can't idle the new diesels without plugging up the particulate filter, but new gas engines no longer have the concern of washing the cylinder walls, so you can idle them without concern. This is important because I will have an underhood generator as a backup.
Sounds like a cool project! I’d love to bui something like an Earthroamer but for a fraction of the price. As for an actual usable all electric F550, I wouldn’t hold your breath. We’re at least a decade or three away from that, if such a thing will even produced at that time.
 
D

Deleted member 9101

Guest
I could get the diesel in that configuration, I just don't want diesel. I always considered diesels better because of reliability and gas mileage, but the reliability is much worse than gas engines now because of all the emissions stuff.

Pop the hood on a 6.7 and then do the same on a 7.3... The 6.7 looks like a PITA to work on...lol.
 

billiebob

Well-known member
I think the problem with a replacement/aftermarket large gasoline tank is going to be government regulation. As far as I know, there’s some law somewhere that says that while you can develop and sell diesel tanks to your hearts content, gasoline tanks are a no-go


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Replacement GAS tanks are a no-go due to the evaporative controls and CARB. Even in Canada. Extremely expensive to certify a gas tank. Beyond CARB comes ferrys, tunnels, parkades. Gasoline is far more flammable than diesel fuel and therefore far more restricted. Someone makes an extended range gas tank for Tacomas but it is extremely expensive and only there for the fan boys with unlimited funds. Same for the Wrangler, someone in Australia builds them but they are outrageously expensive.

On the ferries and parkades thing. In BC and WA you can only carry 2 Jerry Cans, max 10 gallons on a ferry. In BC Jerry Cans with Gas are forbidden in parkades.

The trend in first world countries is away from diesel. And definitely the trend to build a "clean" diesel will kill it. New diesels are definitely not the economical choice today. ULSD and DEF mean diesels have lost any advantage. Some countries predict eliminating ALL diesel engines within the next 15 years. In India, a country with horrendous pollution in big cities they had converted most diesels to CNG 7 years ago when I was there last. Diesel fuel is going the way of the horse.

Watching everything we do today is almost comical. In 1970, the peak of muscle car performance all the magazines were predicting the end was near. Insurance rates were skyrocketing. And the manufacturers were in do or die race to accelerate that death. Then came smog in all the big cities and the governments, lead by California thanks to the geographical location of the Los Angeles valley killed performance with emissions regulations. Add in OPEC and the gas crisis and the automotive world changed forever. Suddenly the Pinto, Vega and Civic were the hottest cars on the market. Overdrive transmissions, 2.73 ratios were the hot ticket option. We are here there again. Insurers are a bit pissed with the excessive power, speed, risk of things like the Raptor. Jeep is teasing with a Hemi for the Wrangler. And everyone is doing their best to one up the market. We have an extremely motivated GREEN crowd pushing to kill fossil fuels..... who seem quite popular on the global front. North America is a tiny part of the world..... Countries like China, India, Europe will set the course for our future. I can't picture gasoline going away too soon, but since diesel is already not the economical choice it will disappear as fast as the heavy truck commercial sector adapts. And commercial transport is only motivated by the bottom line.

Every year the options, regulations on fossil fuels tighten. Years ago California banned changing the exhaust system on Sportbikes. Auto Racing always threatened by residents pissed about the noise, drone from racetracks now have a National body against fossil fuels to side with. I remember a family in Edmonton who lived within site of Edmonton International Speedway totally pissed with the noise. Everyday the movement away from fossil fuels grows.

Me, I could care less. I'm pretty sure I'd love an electric Wrangler. Something that could turn turtle with no fuel or oil or coolant spill. A motor that could run submerged. That would move the vehicle at 40 below. The only negative is the battery and range but consider the Smart Phone. 20 years ago it was the size of a shoe and you also needed a Camera, a PDA, a LapTop, the Tablet was a dream. You needed a GPS plus a TomTom. Get rid of fossil fuels, electric vehicles will jump ahead just as fast. Did I mention drones lol?????? Add drone technology to vehicles...... tie it all into a solar battery and go find a remote camping spot.

Think of the possibilities. The market just needs a demand to fill.

Lots of the technology is here. Mining has been fossil fuel free for decades. The London Tube running on electricity for 140 years, before the gas engine was even invented. 100 years ago UPS had fleets of pure electric delivery trucks. Doctors and the socialite wives of the richest Americans drove electric cars to lunch at the club with other rich wives. Back then a doctor needed reliability. A socialite just wanted clean hands and her husband wanted the chauffeur at his own disposal. We are crazy to be dead set against electric vehicles. The technology for efficient battery technology is obviously here. Gas engines are likely at a peak, any gains will be incremental. But electricity...... exponential gains. Pikes Peak record is held by a pure electric VW. The fastest production cars in the world use hybrid power. Everything underground.... mining is electric. Everything we send to other planets is electric. Our submarines have been hybrid electric since they were invented. The gas powered wahing machine was dead the day it was invented.

 
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mk216v

Der Chef der Fahrzeuge
Yes, Crew Cab, 10 speed, Godzilla. It will be an Earth Roamer sized (14ft floor) camper for about 1/3rd the price. I am designing it for living full time and indefinite boon docking. 4,500W+ of solar, grey water recycling system, rains water collection, 40kWh or battery, 10kW of inverters, all electric, but will a gas Espar hydronic heater for when it gets really cold. My ultimate goal is to put it on an electric F550 whenever they make one with sufficient battery capacity.

I could get the diesel in that configuration, I just don't want diesel. I always considered diesels better because of reliability and gas mileage, but the reliability is much worse than gas engines now because of all the emissions stuff. And the gas mileage advantage keeps decreasing as well. There is also the challenge of finding ULSD outside Canada and the US. Plus, you can't idle the new diesels without plugging up the particulate filter, but new gas engines no longer have the concern of washing the cylinder walls, so you can idle them without concern. This is important because I will have an underhood generator as a backup.
Eager to see this! Please make sure to post a link to your build thread here!
 

CappyJax

Member
Its neither "unapproved" or "experimental."
They are most definitely unapproved and authorized for emergency use. It is not "approved" by the FDA. And since long terms studies are available, it is experimental.

"WHAT IS THE PFIZER-BIONTECH COVID-19 VACCINE?
The Pfizer-BioNTech COVID-19 Vaccine is an unapproved vaccine that may prevent COVID-19. There is no FDA-approved vaccine to prevent COVID-19."


Before you have someone inject something in your body, you should educate yourself first.
 
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