VORSHEER - Introducing Ourselves

shade

Well-known member
I don’t see how that would apply since our goods are as described on our website and the build sheet the customer signs off on.

Either way, this payment option has been made available due to requests made by customers. We assume they want it because it benefits them in some type of way, whether that be protection through the card, the company managing the card, or PayPal itself.
Is there an escrow service that could be used instead of PayPal? That would seem to be the best way to safeguard a customer's funds and ensure that the manufacturer isn't left with unfunded stock.
 

fireball

Explorer
Requiring a 50% deposit, given your background, makes this sound exactly like the same scam Moby ran. When I bought our FWC (a company with 30+? years of history), they required a 30% deposit that one is able to put on credit card.

How about a $5,000 deposit and ~5 equal draw payments as the project progresses and photos are sent to the customer showing trailer construction progress?
 

VORSHEER

Supporting Sponsor / Approved Vendor
That allows Paypal to bow out of a dispute.
Maybe you prefer this one "Anything bought in person (not over the internet)" seeing how there isn't a way to checkout a trailer on your site.

What kind of warranty do your trailers come with?
If a purchase is made through PayPal, it was done over the internet with a credit card. That’s the only way we can send a PayPal invoice to someone, is over the internet. The anything bought in person clause you cited is referencing a payment made in direct exchange for goods. This means that you give me money and I give you goods instantly. As the term deposit implies, it isn't an instant exchange of goods since there is a build time associated with the purchase. So no, that doesn't clause doesn't exclude our trailers. To the best of our knowledge, none of the clauses you stated would exclude our trailers from PayPal's Buyer Protection.

As stated previously, paying through PayPal extends to the credit card or debit card used. Different card companies have different types of buyer protection and insurances which offers another layer of security. We’ve made this option available due to customer request. We can only assume our customers wouldn't request it and opt to pay us through those means if it didn't provide any protection for them.

We offer a one year warranty against manufacturing defects.
 

shade

Well-known member
@VORSHEER - Would you consider working through a process like this one?

Escrow.com: How Milestone Escrow Works
  1. The Buyer and Seller agree to terms - Both parties agree to terms of the transaction, which includes a description of the milestone, price for each milestone, any shipping, the number of milestones, number of days for the Buyer's inspection, and who pays the escrow fee.
  2. The Buyer pays Escrow.com - The Buyer submits an available payment option. Escrow.com verifies the payment. Premier payment methods are not available on milestone transactions.
  3. The Seller delivers milestone - Upon payment verification, the Seller is authorized to deliver the any or all milestones. The Buyer's inspection period is started for each milestone when the Buyer marks the milestone as received or Escrow.com confirms delivery of that milestone.
  4. The Buyer accepts the milestone - The Buyer has a set number of days for an inspection of each milestone and the option to accept or reject each milestone.
  5. Escrow.com pays the Seller - After each milestone is accepted, Escrow.com pays the Seller by the method selected. The transaction is complete when all milestones have been accepted. Sellers will be charged for each wire or overnight check fee.
I know nothing about Escrow.com. I figure they aren't the only company offering this type of service, and the fine print would need to be examined to make sure the provider was a good fit for both parties, but something like this seems like a good way forward.
 

VORSHEER

Supporting Sponsor / Approved Vendor
Is there an escrow service that could be used instead of PayPal? That would seem to be the best way to safeguard a customer's funds and ensure that the manufacturer isn't left with unfunded stock.
While it may seem like a good option, it isn't a good match for our company. Using an escrow account doesn't allow for us to access the funds and purchase parts. Ultimately our goal is no deposit required, which is what we are working towards currently.
Requiring a 50% deposit, given your background, makes this sound exactly like the same scam Moby ran. When I bought our FWC (a company with 30+? years of history), they required a 30% deposit that one is able to put on credit card.

How about a $5,000 deposit and ~5 equal draw payments as the project progresses and photos are sent to the customer showing trailer construction progress?
By given our background I assume you mean the common address and the fact we are former employees. This has been the only "evidence" presented by anyone in any thread we have seen so far (which is all information we have posted ourselves).

Our verifiable background consists of great Facebook and Google reviews (from both Moby1 and non-Moby1 customers), great reviews in the Moby1 Owner's Group on Facebook (which consists of both Moby1 Owners and people who were duped by Moby1), engaging with customers and non-customers on a regular basis and a professional manner through phone calls, email, forums, and social media, Mr. Grimes' public bankruptcy records where the owners of VORSHEER are listed as creditors, a physical business location that is operating six days a week twelve hours a day, an informative website discussing our products and who we are, various types of payment methods we accept (such as credit cards like you mentioned above), and many more things available for anyone to look into.

The issue with a phased payment scheme is that it will push our 30 day lead time well past that mark. Some parts take upwards of three weeks to get. This means that rather than ordering all parts at once, we would have to do it in phases and wait for parts to be delivered which isn't the best way to run a manufacturing facility. While we understand your proposed method when it comes to customer peace of mind, it's not a feasible way to run our current business. That's why we have other methods of payment such as PayPal (which consists of credit cards and debit cards) which some of our customers prefer since they've said it offers payment insurance through different means. As stated above, our end goal is no deposit required which we are working towards currently.
 

VORSHEER

Supporting Sponsor / Approved Vendor
@VORSHEER - Would you consider working through a process like this one?

Escrow.com: How Milestone Escrow Works
  1. The Buyer and Seller agree to terms - Both parties agree to terms of the transaction, which includes a description of the milestone, price for each milestone, any shipping, the number of milestones, number of days for the Buyer's inspection, and who pays the escrow fee.
  2. The Buyer pays Escrow.com - The Buyer submits an available payment option. Escrow.com verifies the payment. Premier payment methods are not available on milestone transactions.
  3. The Seller delivers milestone - Upon payment verification, the Seller is authorized to deliver the any or all milestones. The Buyer's inspection period is started for each milestone when the Buyer marks the milestone as received or Escrow.com confirms delivery of that milestone.
  4. The Buyer accepts the milestone - The Buyer has a set number of days for an inspection of each milestone and the option to accept or reject each milestone.
  5. Escrow.com pays the Seller - After each milestone is accepted, Escrow.com pays the Seller by the method selected. The transaction is complete when all milestones have been accepted. Sellers will be charged for each wire or overnight check fee.
I know nothing about Escrow.com. I figure they aren't the only company offering this type of service, and the fine print would need to be examined to make sure the provider was a good fit for both parties, but something like this seems like a good way forward.
Hey Shade, please see the above post.
 

OverlandNA

Active member
@VORSHEER
Paypal offers card readers for phones: https://www.paypal.com/us/webapps/mpp/credit-card-reader
and a virtual terminal: https://www.paypal.com/us/webapps/mpp/virtual-terminal
Both can be used at POS = Point of Sale making my previous post accurate.
I am just making people aware that they may not be as protected as you are leading them to believe.

You also didn't mention by accepting paypal it could benefit your business due to their 6 month No Payment No Interest promotion that pops up on your site. There is nothing wrong with this except for saying you only use paypal for your customers benefit.
 

OverlandNA

Active member
The issue with a phased payment scheme is that it will push our 30 day lead time well past that mark. Some parts take upwards of three weeks to get. This means that rather than ordering all parts at once, we would have to do it in phases and wait for parts to be delivered which isn't the best way to run a manufacturing facility.
In other words, you do not have the working capital or credit available to manufacture the product(s) that you offer.
 
Last edited:

VORSHEER

Supporting Sponsor / Approved Vendor
@VORSHEER
Paypal offers card readers for phones: https://www.paypal.com/us/webapps/mpp/credit-card-reader
and a virtual terminal: https://www.paypal.com/us/webapps/mpp/virtual-terminal
Both can be used at POS = Point of Sale making my previous post accurate.
I am just making people aware that they may not be as protected as you are leading them to believe.

You also didn't mention by accepting paypal it could benefit your business due to their 6 month No Payment No Interest promotion that pops up on your site. There is nothing wrong with this except for saying you only use paypal for your customers benefit.
Well if we used a POS system then yes, that would be null and void. Unfortunately for your statement above, we don't use a POS system so that is an irrelevant observation to our payment methods.

6 month no interest, no payment option only applies to our store products, not our trailer products. If you notice it only pops up when you click on the Store page on our website. You have to pay through our website, upon checkout you would use a PayPal credit card card to qualify for the financing. Paying for a trailer through our website is not an option, you must contact us and we will generate the invoice through PayPal and send it to you. Could they pay with a PayPal credit card then? Sure, I imagine they could. But that goes back to our point of it offering buyer protection through PayPal or the card company.

In other words, you do not have the working capitol or credit available to manufacture the product(s) that you offer.
Congratulations, you pointed out what is common knowledge of most start up companies. I'd like to thank you for pointing this out, because it negates claims that Moby1 money was used to start VORSHEER. If that was the case we wouldn't need deposits to buy parts, would we?
 

opp

Observer
because it negates claims that Moby1 money was used to start VORSHEER.

I don't think anyone said this of your family. It was all the misinformation when looking at your other information your time line for being a vet looks more like misinformation . could you clear that up. As this is a strong marking tool . It is clear your family that used M1 as there piggy bank dose not have there name on anything with this CO


(ADMIN NOTE: Opp, you are not showing a Gentlemanly protocol in your answers and/or comments. If this trend continues, you'll be offered a temporary vacation from Expedition Portal. Dragging personal history or someone's Linked In profile has nothing to do with this thread.)
 
Last edited:

OverlandNA

Active member
Congratulations, you pointed out what is common knowledge of most start up companies. I'd like to thank you for pointing this out, because it negates claims that Moby1 money was used to start VORSHEER. If that was the case we wouldn't need deposits to buy parts, would we?
There we have the #1 reason small businesses fail - lack of capitol. So go ahead and congratulate me again for pointing that out.
Caveat Emptor & only gamble with money you can afford to lose. I'm out, this isn't the company that will build for me.
 

VORSHEER

Supporting Sponsor / Approved Vendor
There we have the #1 reason small businesses fail - lack of capitol. So go ahead and congratulate me again for pointing that out.
Caveat Emptor & only gamble with money you can afford to lose. I'm out, this isn't the company that will build for me.
Well there is the "gotcha moment" you've been trying so hard to get. As we stated previously, we are working on avenues for no deposit required. Until then, deposits are required.

We're sorry we aren't the trailer company for you, but wish you the best of luck on your search for one! Let us know if you need any recommendations!
 

ebrabaek

Adventurer
Worsheer.
I already have a trailer that I love so I am not in the market. I would however like to lend my support to your effort and fight to establish your company. It is a tall order and hard to do, but IMHO you are doing the right thing. In a kind, and courteous way be transparent, just like you are, and continue to build up your client base, and good things will happen. I fully understand the animosity left behind from the previous owner, but your customers will reflect on you as well. I for one have appreciated your transparency and effort. You are on the right track, and I trust that it will pay up for you, so please don't give up.
 

VORSHEER

Supporting Sponsor / Approved Vendor
Worsheer.
I already have a trailer that I love so I am not in the market. I would however like to lend my support to your effort and fight to establish your company. It is a tall order and hard to do, but IMHO you are doing the right thing. In a kind, and courteous way be transparent, just like you are, and continue to build up your client base, and good things will happen. I fully understand the animosity left behind from the previous owner, but your customers will reflect on you as well. I for one have appreciated your transparency and effort. You are on the right track, and I trust that it will pay up for you, so please don't give up.
Appreciate the kind words. Best of luck to you, and happy adventuring with your trailer!
 
Top