Tundra vs 5.9 Cummins - Help!

[jreilly2120]

Looking for a long term overland vehicle for myself, my girlfriend, and our one (soon to be two) dog/s. I have a nissan frontier with a storage/camper setup built in the back under an ARE MX cap, but between the lack of space, the weak suspension design (even with helper springs and spring clamps I'm getting severe axle wrap on repetitive bumps), and the quickly rising miles, I'm looking to move to a full size. I've put 46k on this truck in 1.5 years of ownership, and that's climbing quickly. My overlanding is exclusively solo and mostly limited to beach and forest road trips, with a lot of highway miles in between, but we spend most weekends living in/out of the truck either sleeping in the back or in a tent. I also need to be able to carry 1500+ lbs of SCUBA gear on a regular basis. My helper springs make it manageable in the Frontier, but not ideal.

I'm starting to shop for a replacement, and I've narrowed my options down to:

1. a 5.9 Cummins short bed 4x4. Auto or Manual.

Pros:
Longevity - Might not have to replace it in the next 4 years/100k miles. Hoping it will last in the 200-300k ballpark.
Payload and bed size
Towing capacity - I'll be moving halfway across the country soon, towing a large trailer comfortably will be a convenience. It'll be nicer towing a horse trailer as well
MPG
Range​

Cons:
Cost
Upkeep
Its a dodge. I've had one 2004 RAM 1500 before, I got out of it because of electrical gremlins I couldn't fix.​

2. A 2008 + Tundra

Pros:
Newer - nicer interior, more modern truck
"Toyota reliability" - reputation for general reliability the dodge doesn't have
Payload and towing capacity are adequate
​

Cons:
MPG - Lifted with 4wd, I'm expecting ~10-13 highway. At 30k miles a year this hurts, and it decreases range.
Cost - At a similar cost, I'm looking at 60-90k miles on one of these.
Life expectancy - its a gas motor. I'm expecting to need to replace the truck around 150k-200k miles at the latest.​

So I'm looking for real-world experience. Anyone had one or both?

 

[Dalko43]

I've spent some time in both types of vehicles. I think you hit the nail on the head with your assessment of the pro's/con's with the 5.9L Dodge Cummins. It's a reliable engine which will get you half decent mpg's, but the truck itself has the potential for issues. I'll be frank in saying Dodge/Ram trucks 2007 and prior just weren't built that well: front end suspension issues; poor interior quality; electrical gremlins. If you can find one that has been well maintained, and that's a big if for some areas, maybe you'll be able to buy one that will work well for your purposes. Otherwise, you may end up getting one that will need significant work to make it comfortable and reliable.

One other con to consider is that now that the 5.9l is 10+ years old, it's fallen into the hands of a lot of young kids and truck bro's (people who buy and modify trucks to drive down main street), and a lot of these engines have been heavily modified for big horsepower (and poor reliability). I would approach any deal with both eyes open and if you see any sign of engine modification, I'd either walk away or demand the owner give you the details on what modifications have been done. The last thing you'd want to do is inherit someone else's mess.

The Tundra of that generation, by comparison, is extremely reliable and will need very little maintenance to keep them going. Their interiors are nothing special, though I think the quality is still a bit better compared to a Dodge of comparable age. Horrible fuel economy (especially when towing) will be the biggest con. But for your purposes, I could see a Tundra working out just fine; it certainly has the payload capabilities.

 

[p nut]

In my opinion, neither. Ram - I don't think your needs justify a diesel and all the baggage that comes with it. Tundra - Just won't have the payload. You say it's adequate, but most 4WD set ups are going to be around 1,500lb payload. Now, that INCLUDES passengers as well. You will be over payload for sure.
-
My opinion: Get a 1/2 ton with HD payload, or get yourself a 3/4 ton gas engine. I'm a bit biased towards Ford at the moment, as they have an HD payload package available on the F150 that should get you near 2,500lbs, and I love the new 3/4 ton Superduty's with the 6.2L gas engine. Also, note that the F150 was tested to be the safest of all others. The flat rear floor should be a plus for you as well, when you've got dogs in the cab. Oh, and rear locker is available on all trim levels. That's all I wanted when I was looking at a new truck - Safety, big rear seats (for kids), and a rear locker (not a necessity, but it was nice to have available).
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I came from the land of Toyota, who makes good trucks. I've had numerous 4Runners, Tacoma's, among other models. I've never owned a Ford, or any domestic truck, until I bought it two years ago. Experience has been great so far, and the truck has exceeded expectations. Wouldn't change a thing if I were to do it again (except maybe a 6.5' bed). Now, if I weren't married or had kids, I would look pretty hard at an F250 with an 8' bed.

 

[Comanche Scott]

In my opinion, neither. Ram - I don't think your needs justify a diesel and all the baggage that comes with it. Tundra - Just won't have the payload. You say it's adequate, but most 4WD set ups are going to be around 1,500lb payload. Now, that INCLUDES passengers as well. You will be over payload for sure.
-
My opinion: Get a 1/2 ton with HD payload, or get yourself a 3/4 ton gas engine. I'm a bit biased towards Ford at the moment, as they have an HD payload package available on the F150 that should get you near 2,500lbs, and I love the new 3/4 ton Superduty's with the 6.2L gas engine. Also, note that the F150 was tested to be the safest of all others. The flat rear floor should be a plus for you as well, when you've got dogs in the cab. Oh, and rear locker is available on all trim levels. That's all I wanted when I was looking at a new truck - Safety, big rear seats (for kids), and a rear locker (not a necessity, but it was nice to have available).
-
I came from the land of Toyota, who makes good trucks. I've had numerous 4Runners, Tacoma's, among other models. I've never owned a Ford, or any domestic truck, until I bought it two years ago. Experience has been great so far, and the truck has exceeded expectations. Wouldn't change a thing if I were to do it again (except maybe a 6.5' bed). Now, if I weren't married or had kids, I would look pretty hard at an F250 with an 8' bed.

X2 :beer:

When looking at either the Dodge or the Toyota spend considerable time underneath looking for rust. With the Dodge it will be worse in the rocker panels. With the Toyota it will be worse in the frame and wheel wells.

Good luck with your choice! :beer:

 

[jreilly2120]

In my opinion, neither. Ram - I don't think your needs justify a diesel and all the baggage that comes with it. Tundra - Just won't have the payload. You say it's adequate, but most 4WD set ups are going to be around 1,500lb payload. Now, that INCLUDES passengers as well. You will be over payload for sure.
-
My opinion: Get a 1/2 ton with HD payload, or get yourself a 3/4 ton gas engine. I'm a bit biased towards Ford at the moment, as they have an HD payload package available on the F150 that should get you near 2,500lbs, and I love the new 3/4 ton Superduty's with the 6.2L gas engine. Also, note that the F150 was tested to be the safest of all others. The flat rear floor should be a plus for you as well, when you've got dogs in the cab. Oh, and rear locker is available on all trim levels. That's all I wanted when I was looking at a new truck - Safety, big rear seats (for kids), and a rear locker (not a necessity, but it was nice to have available).
-
I came from the land of Toyota, who makes good trucks. I've had numerous 4Runners, Tacoma's, among other models. I've never owned a Ford, or any domestic truck, until I bought it two years ago. Experience has been great so far, and the truck has exceeded expectations. Wouldn't change a thing if I were to do it again (except maybe a 6.5' bed). Now, if I weren't married or had kids, I would look pretty hard at an F250 with an 8' bed.

That's fair, and I'm open to the idea of a newer F150. I had a bad experience with the disintegrating gaskets in early 2000s F150s blocking HP oil passages in the motor, but the newer ones look nice. That's why I like forums like this - you get a broader range of experience. As long as what I get can get me across the country a couple times a year reliably, with enough room and payload, I'm happy. Definitely not brand loyal.

 

[p nut]

That's fair, and I'm open to the idea of a newer F150. I had a bad experience with the disintegrating gaskets in early 2000s F150s blocking HP oil passages in the motor, but the newer ones look nice. That's why I like forums like this - you get a broader range of experience. As long as what I get can get me across the country a couple times a year reliably, with enough room and payload, I'm happy. Definitely not brand loyal.

And I'm not sure what your price point is, but honestly, GMC 3/4 ton with the 6.2L is pretty sweet as well. No 3/4 will have the MPG of a 1/2 ton, but keep it stock and keep up on maintenance, and you'll have a dependable truck for your journeys. MPG won't be horrible, though (again, if you keep it stock). 16-18MPG freeway isn't unheard of. That's not too bad. The 5.0 in the F150 will get 20 or above.

 

[Clutch]

I vote Tundra, yeah you'll be at payload maybe a little over, but it will handle it with ease. People over load their trucks all the time...I rarely hear anyone complaining their Tundra has blown up. I used to be really concerned about being under payload...but there are some pretty overloaded Tundras and Tacomas on here...never hear about them failing.

http://www.trucktrend.com/features/1602-the-million-mile-2007-toyota-tundra/


All of the gas trucks are going to get not so great mileage when loaded. Have several moto buds with 5.0's and ecoboost...they all get 10-13 mpg when loaded. Some even sub 10 pulling trailers...

 

[madakira]

Well, it seems I was in a similar situation. It is me, my girlfriend, and two dogs. A 12 lbs Sheltie mix, and a 90 lbs Dogo Argentino. I went from a 2013 Tundra Crew Cab 5.7 V8 4x4, to a 2007 Dodge Ram Mega Cab 2500 diesel 4x4. I do a fair bit of Overlanding and off roading.
The Tundra was nice, but the power was not there. It seemed like a very light truck. Not much torque. If I had added larger tires like I wanted to, it would have been way too weak. Also the room was a factor. I had a crew max, but the back seats did not fold down completely flat like they do in my mega cab, so when I wanted to store stuff back there, or lay the seats flat for the dogs, it just didn't workout.
The biggest issue was the power. It could pull a lot, but you would notice it for sure. I would fill the bed with a dirtbike, firewood, some camping gear, and coolers. It would drive fine, but you definitely knew you were hauling a load. I couldn't imagine doing that with larger tires. The bed is also smaller.
When I went to the Mega Cab, all of those issues were fixed, and I am running 37's. I can easily hit over 20mpg on the freeway. Traveling at 65-70 of course.

 

[p nut]

I vote Tundra, yeah you'll be at payload maybe a little over, but it will handle it with ease. People over load their trucks all the time...I rarely hear anyone complaining their Tundra has blown up. I used to be really concerned about being under payload...but there are some pretty overloaded Tundras and Tacomas on here...never hear about them failing.

http://www.trucktrend.com/features/1602-the-million-mile-2007-toyota-tundra/


All of the gas trucks are going to get not so great mileage when loaded. Have several moto buds with 5.0's and ecoboost...they all get 10-13 mpg when loaded. Some even sub 10 pulling trailers...

Man, I bet most overloaded trucks have survived ok. But so have most people who don't wear seat belts. :sombrero: Carry insurance. Run bald summer tires. I guess we all have our tolerance for risk. For me, I do trust the ratings (and even feel sometimes they're a bit too generous). And hesitate to be even CLOSE to that number. Same with other things, like towing. My truck is at 7,600lb max towing. You probably won't ever catch me pulling near that. The engine will pull it just fine, like on the Tundra. Suspension, braking, steering, etc. will be affected, though. If I were to get into an accident, and someone were to get hurt or worse--probably couldn't live with myself knowing I was stupid enough to ignore clearly laid out capacities of the truck. I'm not passing judgment on anyone else, but just remember the ratings are there for a reason.
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Most of these people are (probably) still alive today!

 

[Clutch]

Man, I bet most overloaded trucks have survived ok.

Have a good dirt bike buddy that always says "You're fiiiiine, until you're not!" Ha ha.


ooooh, I wouldn't sweat a couple hundred pounds over...toss some good springs on the Tundy, you won't even know there are 1500 lbs back there. That 5.7 is a beast and the brakes are damn good. The Tundy is built like a heavy half...if you're too concern with numbers on paper, could always get a heavy half from another manufacture.

We used to down grade some of our medium duty trucks at the DMV so you don't have a CDL....all the while it is physically capable of doing the work, just not on paper.

 

[(none)]

You're comparing a reliable motor to a reliable vehicle.

There is no reason you should have to replace a well maintained gas motor at 150-200k miles. Maintenance is cheap on them, timing belt being the largest expense if it has it. Plus, if you are actually going to be taking it off-road, a cummins motor alone weighs what, 1200lbs? That's not going to help.

 

[charlieaarons]

look at the rear spring pack!!!!

Charlie

 

[p nut]

Have a good dirt bike buddy that always says "You're fiiiiine, until you're not!" Ha ha.


ooooh, I wouldn't sweat a couple hundred pounds over...toss some good springs on the Tundy, you won't even know there are 1500 lbs back there. That 5.7 is a beast and the brakes are damn good. The Tundy is built like a heavy half...if you're too concern with numbers on paper, could always get a heavy half from another manufacture.

We used to down grade some of our medium duty trucks at the DMV so you don't have a CDL....all the while it is physically capable of doing the work, just not on paper.

Ha ha, you sound like my father-in-law! Any time we overload his trailer (only rated at 1,200lbs payload, and he's regularly at 2,000+)--"ah, just cinch her down good. Ain't going nowhere." One time, we were so heavily loaded, it was scary. The blown shocks all around didn't help. Thought I was going to die bouncing down the road with the trailer wagging like crazy!
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I can see downgrading to skirt around some of the regs, but I wouldn't think Toyota would do that with the Tundra. Why understate the payload? I have several family members and friends with 5.7L Tundra's. I think they're good trucks. Brakes are good (although, not any better than other 1/2 tons, from what I can tell. Just did a quick check and essentially the same as an F150), and the engine is great (except for that 3/4 ton-like MPG...unfortunate).
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I still think given his criteria, a HD 1/2 ton or 3/4 ton would be a better choice, and certainly the direction I would go.

 

[js9234]

If you could find a low mileage and well maintained Dodge 5.9 that hasn't been abused I think that would be a no brainer. They are very reliable trucks. I like Toyota's but I think in your situation the 5.9 fits you best.

 

[Clutch]

"ah, just cinch her down good. Ain't going nowhere."

Damn straight!

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I still think given his criteria, a HD 1/2 ton or 3/4 ton would be a better choice, and certainly the direction I would go.

I wouldn't sweat it 1500lbs, and a couple dogs...the Tundy is more than enough.

3/4 ton is a bit over kill, and get crappy mileage all of the time...loaded or not.

Heavy Half (dating myself using that term ) Yeah I agree with ya, handle it with ease, and decent mileage with it unloaded. Since I have been looking at them recently even the F150 non-HD 1/2, 5.0 has a smidge over 2000 lbs payload. Can squeak out 20 mpg hwy unladen.

Would run away from a 5.9 Dodge even if it was given to me. They're getting old, roached out, and command a premium based on internet lure alone...looking at high repair bills at this stage of their service life.