The Dana 50 TTB and getting it under my E350 van.

Abitibi

Explorer
At least your post gets free bumps and stays at the top ;)

And like other said, aside from the entertainment factor I think we all learn something along the way. Kudos on you for taking on this project! I may have missed it but what year is your ttb? Looks like the newer one ('95) seem to have larger brakes...
 

philos

Explorer
I'm not butt-hurt, just want to try and stay focused.
And yes, there's some great info coming out.

As to the axle shaft u-joints, they're 1350s, so same as the D60?


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BajaSportsmobile

Baja Ironman
I'm going to ask another time to remember this is my thread.


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You are getting a lot of free information - that you are going to need. If you ever get to the point where you need to cycle your creation and see if it is going to work - now you know how.

You are welcome...
 

thethePete

Explorer
^ Sorry, gonna have to side with BajaSportsmobile on this one.

You are asking professional builders some really basic questions about suspension geometry and structure. The kind of questions that if you don't already know the answers, you probably shouldn't be building the suspension of a vehicle destined for the road. This is not amature hour. This is not a bush rig that if a link fails it hits a tree. This is something you're planning on bringing on public roads, around other people.

If you're swapping TTB to an iBeam 2wd vehicle, almost everything should nearly bolt up. If you are getting into fabricating new radius arms, or bracketry on the truck, it sounds like you should be shopping out some of this work. There is no cheap, proper way to get into this stuff. If you know how to build it you already spent thousands of dollars and hours learning how. If you don't know, you get to pay someone else who has.

It terrifies me as a professional mechanic and fabricator when I hear people asking really, really basic questions with the intention of doing this type of stuff. It's dangerous.

BajaSportsmobile may be coming off as an "************" or "unhelpful" but he's basically painted you a very clear map of what to do, and if you can't figure out what he's told you, then you're not ready to take on this project.

...he's also right about properly cycling supsension to check for clearance and bump with the spring out. Sorry Ujoint, you explain to me how you get a 700lb+ spring to compress to full bump without having the truck parked under the corner of a building or something. It's impossible to get an adequately weighted spring for driving, to compress enough to adequately check for bump clearances. This is not new, or uncommon in any way. Checking for droop should be done with the spring in, and the shock should never be the limiting droop factor, that's so abusive to the shock it's not even funny.
 

tgreening

Expedition Leader
It terrifies me as a professional mechanic and fabricator when I hear people asking really, really basic questions with the intention of doing this type of stuff. It's dangerous.

And you got to be that way how? It wouldn't have been by by asking those with more knowledge to help you do it the right way would it? Or were you one of the lucky ones, born with all the skill and knowledge required?[/quote]


...he's also right about properly cycling supsension to check for clearance and bump with the spring out. Sorry Ujoint, you explain to me how you get a 700lb+ spring to compress to full bump without having the truck parked under the corner of a building or something. It's impossible to get an adequately weighted spring for driving, to compress enough to adequately check for bump clearances. This is not new, or uncommon in any way. Checking for droop should be done with the spring in, and the shock should never be the limiting droop factor, that's so abusive to the shock it's not even funny.

I haven't messed with a coil sprung vehicle in quite a while, and I'm sure it depends on the vehicle and its intended purpose, but every leaf sprung vehicle I've ever modded would easily compress to the spring to the point you would start doing damage if you did it repeatedly. Pick one corner of most vehicles off-road vehicles off the ground to the point the entire front or rear starts to come up and most springs easily compress. Yes, there are always exceptions.
 

BajaSportsmobile

Baja Ironman
Thank you for the comments - except perhaps the "************" part, LOL. I have re-read all my posts in this thread and don't see it.

Just to make a couple of comments... TTB's do not share the same pivot points as their 2wd counterpoints, and will not "nearly bolt up". The spring/shock towers are in the right place...

FOX Shocks are designed to act as a top out limiter and have an internal rubber snubber. We do "time" the shock, with internal spacing, to top out when the spring is full extended.


^ Sorry, gonna have to side with BajaSportsmobile on this one.

If you're swapping TTB to an iBeam 2wd vehicle, almost everything should nearly bolt up.

Checking for droop should be done with the spring in, and the shock should never be the limiting droop factor, that's so abusive to the shock it's not even funny.
 

BajaSportsmobile

Baja Ironman
I haven't messed with a coil sprung vehicle in quite a while, and I'm sure it depends on the vehicle and its intended purpose, but every leaf sprung vehicle I've ever modded would easily compress to the spring to the point you would start doing damage if you did it repeatedly. Pick one corner of most vehicles off-road vehicles off the ground to the point the entire front or rear starts to come up and most springs easily compress. Yes, there are always exceptions.
I've not had the same experience...

If you can statically "easily compress the spring to the point you would start doing damage if you did it repeatedly" then you are asking for damage.

I guess I just don't understand.

This is a great discussion, from a learning standpoint, that could be very helpful to people and their projects.

Maybe it would be good to start a "Technical Discussions" thread to address such subjects.
 

Abitibi

Explorer
And you got to be that way how? It wouldn't have been by by asking those with more knowledge to help you do it the right way would it? Or were you one of the lucky ones, born with all the skill and knowledge required?
You go to school and pay your tuition, you work as an apprentice and put many volunteer hours, etc... Nothing to do with being the lucky one. I'm not sure why people are getting so worked up with this. You got a professional giving you advices for free, take what you want or need and carry on! I love seing people tackling these kind of projects but not so much the finger pointing showing up.

I know that I don't have the skills to take on such a project safely so I'll work hard at what I'm good at to earn extra cash and will pay to get it done.

Now back on track! Any update on your project? Have you figured if there are parts you can buy or adapt instead of building from scratch?
 

tgreening

Expedition Leader
I've not had the same experience...

If you can statically "easily compress the spring to the point you would start doing damage if you did it repeatedly" then you are asking for damage.

I guess I just don't understand.

This is a great discussion, from a learning standpoint, that could be very helpful to people and their projects.

Maybe it would be good to start a "Technical Discussions" thread to address such subjects.

Asking for damage, absolutely. I was just stating that it will compress, by lifting the corner, and that it doesn't necessarily have to be "under the corner of a building".

I'm not saying it should be left like that. I'm sure you're well aware that forcing a leaf into negative arch is bad for it, hence the use of properly designed/placed bump stops. I'm sure there's a mathematical formula somewhere that will tell you how long a bump stop needs to be by calculating spring length, arch, placement, and blah blah, but the quick and dirty method for use mathematically challenged s to grab the corner with a toe motor and lift it till A) the tire stuffs into something, B) the spring starts to over compress, or C) all the above or any other thing/combination of things that would be considered Bad for the Front End. Take notes and fix issues.
 
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tgreening

Expedition Leader
You go to school and pay your tuition, you work as an apprentice and put many volunteer hours, etc... Nothing to do with being the lucky one.

Now back on track! Any update on your project? Have you figured if there are parts you can buy or adapt instead of building from scratch?


Just being a bit sarcastic. IOW, somebody taught him, whether paid for or got for free. Everybody starts at the bottom. Ok, I'm done with all that.


And yes, back to the build. Maybe a concise status update for the folks that jump to the end? A "where I'm at" kind of thing.
 

philos

Explorer
^ Sorry, gonna have to side with BajaSportsmobile on this one.

You are asking professional builders some really basic questions about suspension geometry and structure. The kind of questions that if you don't already know the answers, you probably shouldn't be building the suspension of a vehicle destined for the road. This is not amature hour. This is not a bush rig that if a link fails it hits a tree. This is something you're planning on bringing on public roads, around other people.

If you're swapping TTB to an iBeam 2wd vehicle, almost everything should nearly bolt up. If you are getting into fabricating new radius arms, or bracketry on the truck, it sounds like you should be shopping out some of this work. There is no cheap, proper way to get into this stuff. If you know how to build it you already spent thousands of dollars and hours learning how. If you don't know, you get to pay someone else who has.

It terrifies me as a professional mechanic and fabricator when I hear people asking really, really basic questions with the intention of doing this type of stuff. It's dangerous.

BajaSportsmobile may be coming off as an "************" or "unhelpful" but he's basically painted you a very clear map of what to do, and if you can't figure out what he's told you, then you're not ready to take on this project.

...he's also right about properly cycling supsension to check for clearance and bump with the spring out. Sorry Ujoint, you explain to me how you get a 700lb+ spring to compress to full bump without having the truck parked under the corner of a building or something. It's impossible to get an adequately weighted spring for driving, to compress enough to adequately check for bump clearances. This is not new, or uncommon in any way. Checking for droop should be done with the spring in, and the shock should never be the limiting droop factor, that's so abusive to the shock it's not even funny.
Go pound sand if you're going to come in here and call names. Nobody here ever called Ramsey an ************, and poo-pooing us "amateurs" is a jerk move. You don't know me nor my skill set.
There are also at least two there here with axles in their possession and asking/contributing positively.

...almost everything should bolt up....
LOL who's the amateur now?


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philos

Explorer
Here's a first mock up of how I'm going to try and make my ABS work.
I cut the back off a junkyard sensor that matches the one on my van.

Dropped a spare tone ring on the D50 hub; you can see where the hub tapers and will have to be machined. A spacer will also have to be turned down to locate and secure the tone ring to the hub.

Set everything on a knuckle and this is an idea of what I'm going for. The sensor bracket will have to be trimmed to get it close to the hub. The spindle will need a hole in its base. The knuckle will also get a hole for the back of the sensor to go through once I do the maths with the machine shop.

You can see where the sensor brackets need trimming on the sides to clear the studs. Tone ring is clearly not located sitting on the studs, but it's a visual idea of where I'm going.
Machine shop is in Ventura and is a friend of a very good friend. It'll be at least a few more weeks before I can get over there, but we've been chatting and he's into helping out. I've already been to the shop and it's super nice.


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thethePete

Explorer
Go pound sand if you're going to come in here and call names. Nobody here ever called Ramsey an ************, and poo-pooing us "amateurs" is a jerk move. You don't know me nor my skill set.
There are also at least two there here with axles in their possession and asking/contributing positively.

...almost everything should bolt up....
LOL who's the amateur now?


Sent via flux capacitor
I'm just glad you don't live anywhere near where I'm driving. And yes. Several people accused him of playing games and not providing useful info.

You're right. I dont know your skill set but if you're asking basic questions like in this thread it tells me you lack the required background knowledge to safely do this. Why do you think Ramsay has sounded so doubtful. It's not poopooing you its looking out for the safety of others. Forgive my selflessness.

I don't have to prove myself to you. I know what I've accomplished and what I'm capable of. Several people have provided more than enough information for a competent person to accomplish this. If you feel you still can't do it with the info provided it is beyond what you can safely accomplish. But whatever. I forgot. I'm an amateur.

Good luck, and stay away from Canada if you ever manage to get this thing on the road. Anyone can collect a pile of parts and daydream.

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