Studded vs non-studded Nokian LT2/3 - calling fellow northerners & Canadians

DieselRanger

Well-known member
Northern folks with yrs of experience using true winter tires and studded on HD vehicles (not sedans/cars) I would like your use experience and opinion on choosing studded vs non-studded of same model. For example Nokian offers several models in both versions. I have used the LT2 studded a couple seasons and in the narrow 245/75-17 it provides incredible tracking through the slop as well as great traction on hard pack due to the increased ground pressure from it's narrow width.

I am considering a new set and am biting on the marketing of their even better new stud tech in the LT3. Now they are also making it in an almost ideal size of 265/70-18 though it would be giving up some of the narrow benefits of the above profile. 1" on width while gaining ground clearance but honestly, the clearance is not an issue because there's so much to begin with and when the snow is deep, it's generally just too deep regardless.

As for the idea of super wide tundra type flotation, I don't think that's going to happen on my 7400 lb lr3 with it's inability to fit a huge width tire anyway. Plus, in the US you're not out on Iceland type terrain anyway.


Main question here is studs vs not.

I have the luxury of using different vehicles for different outings such that a the studded vehicle wouldn't need to be used to go out around the low lands on daily basis and would be left parked for use only when traveling into the mtns and/or during storms or on a north/winter specific trip. For people who live somewhere less fluctuating that can be hard to understand. In Seattle area you can stay out of snow all winter honestly unless there's a freak lowland storm or you can drive in it every weekend or the whole time on a trip north/inland to BC, Idaho, etc.

If you want to post that you love Blizzacks or don't see the need for studs, just don't post.

I have lots of experience with Hakka's - they are THE best winter tire IMO. If you're going to be regularly driving on hardpacked icy roads or when there's black ice under fresh snow then you need studs. Only studs or chains help maintain the most control on ice (primarily stopping and turning - starting off is generally fine on non-studded winter tires in my experience), but I will say that their non-studded tires are pretty amazing as they incorporate tiny glass particles into their tread compound for "microtraction". But, on real ice, momentum will overwhelm any non-studded tire.

Here in CO I don't go studs because the sun generally bakes the snow off the local roads after a day or two even when it's in the teens or twenties F, and I live on the Front Range so the temp is very variable. When I travel to ski areas, even when it's snowing, they're good enough. If I lived somewhere like Ouray or Silverton, I'd absolutely have studs on my tires as the roads never get cleaned well and there are enough permanent shadows to keep the sun from subliming away the snow. Pic below is between Ouray and Silverton. No guardrail and 100's of feet down.

1576780097630.png

My problem is Hakka's sell out here generally by October, and then you have to wait until Jan/Feb to get them...I got stuck with Hankook I*Pike RW11 and they Suuuuuuuuck on anything but cold, dry pavement or fresh unpacked snow. Cold packed powder they're OK.

EDIT: If you go without studs, I'd actually recommend the R3 SUV unless you have to drive off-road in snow. If you're just doing road trips then the R3 will actually give you better fuel economy than an AT tire, and probably better performance in a wide variety of snow conditions. Nokian builds all their SUV tires with Kevlar armor in the sidewalls now so that's a wash. I ran R2 SUVs on my nearly 6,000lb Touareg and they were like tank treads, but I got 3-4mpg better combined than my Wrangler ATs.
 
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AbleGuy

Officious Intermeddler
you need to bring Ural to Nakusp

The B.C Kootneys and Selkirks...Such a wonderfully awesome, scenic area...probably some of the most beautiful country in North America. So, my vote....pastries at Mennonite bakery in Creston, on up over Stagleap Pass (any Mt. Caribou left there licking salt off the road?), past Salmo and Ymir and down into Nelson (stop at Mike’s Pub and catch a few pints of NBC brews), then wander up north along Kootney lake past Kaslo, over the mountains thru and past old mining area and part ghost town, then down into quaint New Denver...time for another beer at Odin’s Pub there, head down along Slocan lake to Slocan, close the loop by returning to Nelson and stay for the night at historic Hume Hotel.

Cheers!
 
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AbleGuy

Officious Intermeddler
Northern folks with yrs of experience using true winter tires and studded on HD vehicles (not sedans/cars) I would like your use experience and opinion on choosing studded vs non-studded of same model.
As for the idea of super wide tundra type flotation, I don't think that's going to happen on my 7400 lb lr3 with it's inability to fit a huge width tire anyway. Plus, in the US you're not out on Iceland type terrain anyway.
Main question here is studs vs not.
If you want to post that you love Blizzacks or don't see the need for studs, just don't post.

Hoping not to offend by passing right by the studs....but have you considered siped tires with the walnut shells imbedded in the tread? When we lived up near the BC border (in an area where the average annual snowfall was @90”), I ran on them for my HD 3/4 T 4x4, on a set of separate winter rims.

OP didn’t want anecdotal info on non HD rigs, but since billiebob brought up the Subys...yeah, I’ll have to agree with his experiences...our Outbacks ran on all winter on either studded tires or walnut shell siped tires. One year, driving from Calgary to Coeur d’Alene in late December in way below freezing temps, over and through the Canadian Rockies on mostly unplowed highways with heavy new snow on the road and still falling, our Outback with studded tires was dangerously rock solid, to the point of making me probably a wee bit over confident about my driving. God was that an incredible blast though, almost no traffic to deal with, bombing down those winding roads, through that amazingly beautiful, wild and scenic winter wonderland, on sure-footed tires and AWD.
 
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Todd n Natalie

OverCamper
Hoping not to offend by passing right by the studs....but have you considered siped tires with the walnut shells imbedded in the tread? When we lived up near the BC border (in an area where the average annual snowfall was @90”), I ran on them for my HD 3/4 T 4x4, on a set of separate winter rims.
My old boss had winter tires with walnut shells in them and raved about them. For the life of me, I can't recall what they were though.
 

DieselRanger

Well-known member
My old boss had winter tires with walnut shells in them and raved about them. For the life of me, I can't recall what they were though.
Toyo makes some, and Les Schwab carries a cheaper version under their house brand I think. The selling point for them is that Walnut shells are among the hardest of natural fibers, but against ice there are cheaper alternatives to impregnate rubber with, such as glass.
 

Todd n Natalie

OverCamper
Toyo makes some, and Les Schwab carries a cheaper version under their house brand I think. The selling point for them is that Walnut shells are among the hardest of natural fibers, but against ice there are cheaper alternatives to impregnate rubber with, such as glass.
Maybe they were Toyos? I don't think there is a Les Schwab around here.
 

voodoojk

Adventurer
I have been selling Nokians for 12 years now.. And this is what i tell my customers. If your doing any highway driving / long distance go with the stud-less Nokian R3. If you are only driving around your mtn town ( in this case Aspen) and you have a steep snow covered driveway go for studs. Some of my customers dont leave town...ever. in their vehicle so studded tires do great on the icy winter streets and driveways. I have plenty of studded and most non studded sizes in stock ( fpr modern LR sizes) but they are getting low and hard to get this late in the season.
 

Jwestpro

Explorer
EDIT: If you go without studs, I'd actually recommend the R3 SUV unless you have to drive off-road in snow. If you're just doing road trips then the R3 will actually give you better fuel economy than an AT tire, and probably better performance in a wide variety of snow conditions. Nokian builds all their SUV tires with Kevlar armor in the sidewalls now so that's a wash. I ran R2 SUVs on my nearly 6,000lb Touareg and they were like tank treads, but I got 3-4mpg better combined than my Wrangler ATs.

thanks for the input but my lr3 weighs 7200-8400 depending on the trip so a non E load tire won't be happening but I do like the R2 on my bmw 535 wagon.
 

headdamage

Observer
Living in Calgary and having lived for 5 years in Yellowknife where I drove the winter roads I am a fan of studded tires. My favorite set up is Duratracs with studs which is what is currently on my RRC. This time last year I put a set of Hapakalita factory studded tires on my 2500HD, they are an excellent winter tire but I've recently noticed I've lost quit a few studs from them, this seems odd to me because this has not been a problem with two previous sets Duratracs and Territory tires that I had studded at purchase. I was told that the factory studded tires held onto their studs much better than had studded tires.
 

Jwestpro

Explorer
I think I mentioned they I currently have the studded Nokian LT2 in narrow 245/75-17 on factory 17x7. While overkill a lot of the time, when it’s the right time, it’s like nothing else to have studs on compacted snow and ice. like two weeks ago in eastern Washington and over all the passes, even into the foothills toward seattle,.24193447-E1B9-4709-8923-E4CA7E8DDBC6.jpeg
 

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