Rusty Frame Recall - not going as hoped / $5,000 additional cost

superbuickguy

Explorer
Not fishing for clients, but it's something I do as an attorney and I'm in Washington. There are several problems, but before I went and saw and attorney I'd complain to the Washington Attorney General and complain that the dealership did not provide a timely, written estimate. Hopefully, he'll get help (free) from the ATG's office and won't need to hire an attorney. If that doesn't work, get an attorney - there are several fishy things here that are worth pursuing - most notable is their claim that these were surprises.... yeah, right.

good luck.
 

Dances with Wolves

aka jk240sx
I'm with Superbuickguy on this one. I'm an insurance agent. When something goes wrong regarding insurance and people start talking lawyers, I send them to the State Insurance Commissioner to file a complaint. You would be surprised how quickly issues are resolved. Nobody likes to get under Big Brother's microscope.
 

surlydiesel

Adventurer
I will just mention that Toyota could have just said, "sorry about the rusty frame, good luck". Yes that would have lost a lot of customers but I can't imagine this whole ordeal hasn't cost them customers and I can't fathom how much money. Out of the 1000's of frames that have been swapped out, this one person has a problem, most likely with a dealer who is not familiar with the process. I was just glad Toyota stood behind their product and fixed a huge problem they had, if not, I'd have been out two trucks now.

If the owner of this truck has older rusted parts on the truck, from years in the rust belt, it's not the dealer's fault that they can't put the truck back together with these parts. I had to replace my oil pan last March due to rust, was that Toyota's fault? It's a 15 year old truck and I live in NJ. I'm lucky the rear bumper hasn't fallen off. There is so much salt and other snow prep crap on the roads here that vehicles barely last 5 years without cancer.

What I'm getting at is, if you live in an area where they treat the roads in the winter, unless you are beyond diligent with upkeep, your vehicles will rust to bits and the parts attached will suffer the same fate. When I look to buy a "new" Tacoma, I'll be looking for an 05-08 with a recent frame replacement and around 100k miles. That truck will run another 100k and by then, the rust will have caught up on the rest of the truck and it will be most likely be beyond repair. You can't expect a vehicle to last 20 year when exposed to salt, no matter the manufacturer.

Skip the lawyers, skip the angry calls to your state agencies, pay for some new parts and drive your truck for 100k more miles, prob more since you live a in a relatively rust free vehicle zone now. Maybe you could offer to sell it to someone for the cost of repair. I think you might find some buyers...you could prob ask 3k on top of the repair price and still have buyers.

Sorry for the rant, I just don't understand the issues here...you can't make rusty parts new again.

-jorge
 

Rockhounder

Explorer
Speaking of rust from salt problems, has anybody tried coating the entire underside of their vehicles with truck bed liner (the sprayed on kind)? I wonder if that would do good, or if water would wick in and make it worse from moving part seams, etc?
 

TommyG

Adventurer
I will just mention that Toyota could have just said, "sorry about the rusty frame, good luck". Yes that would have lost a lot of customers but I can't imagine this whole ordeal hasn't cost them customers and I can't fathom how much money. Out of the 1000's of frames that have been swapped out, this one person has a problem, most likely with a dealer who is not familiar with the process. I was just glad Toyota stood behind their product and fixed a huge problem they had, if not, I'd have been out two trucks now.

If the owner of this truck has older rusted parts on the truck, from years in the rust belt, it's not the dealer's fault that they can't put the truck back together with these parts. I had to replace my oil pan last March due to rust, was that Toyota's fault? It's a 15 year old truck and I live in NJ. I'm lucky the rear bumper hasn't fallen off. There is so much salt and other snow prep crap on the roads here that vehicles barely last 5 years without cancer.

What I'm getting at is, if you live in an area where they treat the roads in the winter, unless you are beyond diligent with upkeep, your vehicles will rust to bits and the parts attached will suffer the same fate. When I look to buy a "new" Tacoma, I'll be looking for an 05-08 with a recent frame replacement and around 100k miles. That truck will run another 100k and by then, the rust will have caught up on the rest of the truck and it will be most likely be beyond repair. You can't expect a vehicle to last 20 year when exposed to salt, no matter the manufacturer.

Skip the lawyers, skip the angry calls to your state agencies, pay for some new parts and drive your truck for 100k more miles, prob more since you live a in a relatively rust free vehicle zone now. Maybe you could offer to sell it to someone for the cost of repair. I think you might find some buyers...you could prob ask 3k on top of the repair price and still have buyers.

Sorry for the rant, I just don't understand the issues here...you can't make rusty parts new again.

-jorge

It is a bad situation for everyone. Toyota covers the frame and labor. The dealership can't afford to eat the price of the additional parts that are needed for the swap on many vehicles. In many cases they are repairing vehicles that they did not sell in the first place. The consumer, through no fault of their own is faced with a potential significant expense to keep driving a vehicle that they have already paid a fair amount for. The consumer has a reasonable expectation that the vehicle should be reasonably good to go for the foreseeable future. Everyone loses.
 

bkg

Explorer
It is a bad situation for everyone. Toyota covers the frame and labor. The dealership can't afford to eat the price of the additional parts that are needed for the swap on many vehicles. In many cases they are repairing vehicles that they did not sell in the first place. The consumer, through no fault of their own is faced with a potential significant expense to keep driving a vehicle that they have already paid a fair amount for. The consumer has a reasonable expectation that the vehicle should be reasonably good to go for the foreseeable future. Everyone loses.

Kind of... Maybe... I don't know...

I struggle with the "The consumer has a reasonable expectation that the vehicle should be reasonably good to go for the foreseeable future." statement... Not because it shouldn't be true, but because it begs the question "what expectations are realistic?" Parts rust, parts go bad, parts need to be replaced... seems like this situation is just a 1:million perfect storm for all of these items at once.

Should Toyota replace a rusty exhaust? I don't think so - that's a wear item. Should Toyota replace all things related to the frame swap? Probably, but I also think there are rational limits.

Considering Toyota was buying many of these trucks back @ 150% of retail value, I think they've gone farther than some would state needed.
 

fredgoodsell

Adventurer
Considering Toyota was buying many of these trucks back @ 150% of retail value, I think they've gone farther than some would state needed.
Just a clarification: the buy back was only offered for 1st gen Tacomas. On 2nd gens that are eligible, you either get a "pass" and an undercoating, or a "fail" and a new frame.

Been waiting 2 months so far for my frame to come in...
 

mezmochill

Is outside
That's what businesses do... sell stuff for more than it cost to manufacture. No one forces you to pay for it, you are free to build your own truck.

You are free to do your own surgery.

Please don't go into building anything that requires safety as a factor. Hey its just money, don't like it too bad. I hope the next generation sees through this tripe.:)
Goooo corps!!!
 
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bkg

Explorer
Just a clarification: the buy back was only offered for 1st gen Tacomas. On 2nd gens that are eligible, you either get a "pass" and an undercoating, or a "fail" and a new frame.

Been waiting 2 months so far for my frame to come in...

Yes. Sorry - that was 1st gens. Buddy made out like a mad.man on his 99.
 

Dances with Wolves

aka jk240sx
Been waiting 2 months so far for my frame to come in...

Is your truck from Utah? I didn't think a rusted-out frame would be a problem here. I'm doing fluid film next spring as a precaution. My undercarriage looks brand new, but I'm pretty anal about keeping my vehicles clean. In the spring I take them to a car wash for big rigs and get the undercarriage sprayed down.
 

fredgoodsell

Adventurer
Is your truck from Utah? I didn't think a rusted-out frame would be a problem here. I'm doing fluid film next spring as a precaution. My undercarriage looks brand new, but I'm pretty anal about keeping my vehicles clean. In the spring I take them to a car wash for big rigs and get the undercarriage sprayed down.
Yep. Bought it here and it's been here in the intermountain west its whole life. 2005 w/ 175k miles. I've never fluid filmed or otherwise treated the frame, but have always been good about cleaning undercarriage. When I first made the appointment, both dealers said the frames they've failed had mostly been east coast transplants.
I can put my fingers inside my frame rails through the rust hole. Scary.
 

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