Road & Track - Defender
- Thread starter jh.
- Start date
newhue
Adventurer
They all look nice, but a bit piss pore for a swan song imo. No winches, lockers, soft top, wheels on bonnets, bigger fuel tank or so on. Just paint colours, stickers, badges, wheels, and city slicker trim on the autocon. Crikey even choosing G4 somewhat limited fame over Camel's for a colour to sell the final hoo raa. All look with little purpose or value really. I guess the remap to 147hp is good but they could have and should have done that sine 2007 as well. Led lights is a good touch. Must be keeping portals, slightly wider and longer cabin space, and the TD6 for the new release hey.....
When you look back to 1948, the vehicle had purpose. Things like PTO's, removable doors or door tops, crank handles, storage boxes. And the company had vision. Now it seems it's all about just selling the dream of that old vision. Safety, pollution, no brain driving aids, and lack of interest all have taken their toll. I guess a spin to the shopping centre in a Defender can be quite an adventure, or that's about all that will be possible if things keep up.
When you look back to 1948, the vehicle had purpose. Things like PTO's, removable doors or door tops, crank handles, storage boxes. And the company had vision. Now it seems it's all about just selling the dream of that old vision. Safety, pollution, no brain driving aids, and lack of interest all have taken their toll. I guess a spin to the shopping centre in a Defender can be quite an adventure, or that's about all that will be possible if things keep up.
roverandom
Adventurer
I just don't care.
I don't care about a unit I can't buy here that comes with special trim and paint.
I don't care about $150K Range Rovers.
I don't care about the new RRS that can lap the race tracks faster than any other SUV.
I don't care about the Evoke, Discovery Sport, Freelander or anything Gerry MaGovern or TATA have done with Land Rover.
They have focused on new markets I don't care about and abandoned the old ones I do care about.
Oh well, perhaps Jaguar will start making rugged, down to earth utility 4x4's?
I don't care about a unit I can't buy here that comes with special trim and paint.
I don't care about $150K Range Rovers.
I don't care about the new RRS that can lap the race tracks faster than any other SUV.
I don't care about the Evoke, Discovery Sport, Freelander or anything Gerry MaGovern or TATA have done with Land Rover.
They have focused on new markets I don't care about and abandoned the old ones I do care about.
Oh well, perhaps Jaguar will start making rugged, down to earth utility 4x4's?
Kgh
Let’s go already!
Hmmm
All the build mods listed in this thread would be fantastic on a new Defender.
But...These guys are in business to sell as many vehicles as possible. Period. And what sells is not lockers, portals (really?) or a very niche market garish yellow paint job. If the market were clamoring for a 10 passenger tractor-box that could go anywhere, we would see them on dealer lots.
It is like asking for a Jeep Wrangler Diesel. Why hasen't CJD even bother here in US? A huge logistical tail, massive retraining, etc, so they can make a few off roaders and eco minded people happy?
Wranglers sell. Very well, actually. Why add options, other than paint and BS, to something that works for the business model? Base models and Saharas far outsell Rubicons. Same goes for LR and RR. The soccer mom and Dentist crowds are keeping the factories churning. Why would Tata go after such a small segment of the market? And in seeing what we here drive, we are not grabbing up '14 and '15 MY vehicles, so our wishes for a real off roader in the aftermarket are going to be just wishes. With enough demand, LR could have engineered airbag, impact protection, and EPA compliant Defenders. There was not enough demand to make it a worthwhile investment for them.
If an AMG/COPO/AEV type of modded Defender (built to perform in specific environment) were made, and costs for compliance factored in, we are probably looking at a $75,000 vehicle on our shores. Question is, how many ExPo people would buy one new?
All the build mods listed in this thread would be fantastic on a new Defender.
But...These guys are in business to sell as many vehicles as possible. Period. And what sells is not lockers, portals (really?) or a very niche market garish yellow paint job. If the market were clamoring for a 10 passenger tractor-box that could go anywhere, we would see them on dealer lots.
It is like asking for a Jeep Wrangler Diesel. Why hasen't CJD even bother here in US? A huge logistical tail, massive retraining, etc, so they can make a few off roaders and eco minded people happy?
Wranglers sell. Very well, actually. Why add options, other than paint and BS, to something that works for the business model? Base models and Saharas far outsell Rubicons. Same goes for LR and RR. The soccer mom and Dentist crowds are keeping the factories churning. Why would Tata go after such a small segment of the market? And in seeing what we here drive, we are not grabbing up '14 and '15 MY vehicles, so our wishes for a real off roader in the aftermarket are going to be just wishes. With enough demand, LR could have engineered airbag, impact protection, and EPA compliant Defenders. There was not enough demand to make it a worthwhile investment for them.
If an AMG/COPO/AEV type of modded Defender (built to perform in specific environment) were made, and costs for compliance factored in, we are probably looking at a $75,000 vehicle on our shores. Question is, how many ExPo people would buy one new?
newhue
Adventurer
yeh I don't know, you guys are the rock crawling capital of the world so a portal option may have merit, small as it may be, but these end of an era Defender aren't in big numbers but their price is. No doubt manufacturers work with whats easiest and cheapest to put to the market. But they push what works for them, and then say they have listed to the market and added colour coded bumbers and mirrors because that's what the market wants. Like yeh right, or if that's true we are a sad shallow lot. Perhaps a galvanised chassis would be a better seller. From my experience most manufacturers ask am I happy with the customer support then largely stop there, if they ask at all. Very few ask me questions leading to what I like-desire in a product.
Why go after such small markets, I understand your direction. But I guess LR was founded on giving UK farmers a basic vehicle to get farming and manufacturing back on it's feet after WW2. Probably still just as relevant today to UK as in 1945. Some shiny wheels, bit of leather trim, flash paint job isn't particularly creative, and a sad way to finish off LR's foundations. Foundations that they keenly work into their marketing to sell Discos and RR to soccer mums who are looking for a bit of one up. Over worked Dads dream of adventure but fail to get there because they are to busy, so they buy shiny wheels in hope one day they will. It's a common marketing platform, its easy and works, and the market buys it.
I might be out there but I don't believe I am. I paid 60K for a basic 130, put 20K into it with accessories, and had lease interest chucked into the bill as well. I'd happily pay LR 80K for a complete drive out LR with bells. It would be easier, faster, warranted, and I have what I wanted. Let alone unique to the market. A Niche vehicle as LR put it.
Why go after such small markets, I understand your direction. But I guess LR was founded on giving UK farmers a basic vehicle to get farming and manufacturing back on it's feet after WW2. Probably still just as relevant today to UK as in 1945. Some shiny wheels, bit of leather trim, flash paint job isn't particularly creative, and a sad way to finish off LR's foundations. Foundations that they keenly work into their marketing to sell Discos and RR to soccer mums who are looking for a bit of one up. Over worked Dads dream of adventure but fail to get there because they are to busy, so they buy shiny wheels in hope one day they will. It's a common marketing platform, its easy and works, and the market buys it.
I might be out there but I don't believe I am. I paid 60K for a basic 130, put 20K into it with accessories, and had lease interest chucked into the bill as well. I'd happily pay LR 80K for a complete drive out LR with bells. It would be easier, faster, warranted, and I have what I wanted. Let alone unique to the market. A Niche vehicle as LR put it.
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Kgh
Let’s go already!
Soccer moms and dreaming dads. That is the demographic, you nailed it.
It is in LRs interest to sell Rangies to these people. And they will sell 50 of them before one LR4 has a rack and skidplates added for true off road use.
Do they want to sell a number of hard core vehicles a year? Not at expesnse of 20,000 luxury units that will spend the first 4-5 years getting dealer serviced.
Would I pay what you paid? Hell yes. If it were available here. That is why my D110 is a 25y/o being made like the new Defender I cannot get here.
Here is some of why they do what they do.
It is in LRs interest to sell Rangies to these people. And they will sell 50 of them before one LR4 has a rack and skidplates added for true off road use.
Do they want to sell a number of hard core vehicles a year? Not at expesnse of 20,000 luxury units that will spend the first 4-5 years getting dealer serviced.
Would I pay what you paid? Hell yes. If it were available here. That is why my D110 is a 25y/o being made like the new Defender I cannot get here.
Here is some of why they do what they do.