Question for the corpsman...

[jh504]

Think about a Wilderness EMT (or Advanced First Aid, or first responder) course.....better for the back country.

Good advice. You will have a better chance at having a higher caliber of teaching with one of these as well. A class is only as good as the people who put it on and some of these community college EMT classes are a joke.

 

[Deleted member 9101]

Even though EMT-Basic may not be "ideal training" for a combat environment it will really open things up to you with anatomy and the way the human body works with injuries. I would recommend anyone to take an EMT-Basic course. Who knows, you may get hooked.

When I teach CLS you want to know the first thing I ask? "who is a EMT or has civilian medical experience?" then I tell them to forget everything the civilian world taught them, as its not practical on the battlefield.

Although its help full, it ends up doing more harm than good in the long run.

 

[Deleted member 9101]

Think about a Wilderness EMT (or Advanced First Aid, or first responder) course.....better for the back country.

He could always ask the Medics in his unit.

 

[baca327]

I did talk to a corpsman in my unit and was told CPR would be a big help instead of waiting and taking a corpsman from other casualties. Being in the marine corps with a family makes it very hard to take off time for a emt wilderness class or emt class. I would like a better understanding of the anatomy of trauma and treatment of more complicated injuries that can save a life. A live tissue course is about it for availability. I'm gonna have to read and teach myself on down time. As stated earlier I think I'm hooked. Thanks again for the input.

 

[jh504]

When I teach CLS you want to know the first thing I ask? "who is a EMT or has civilian medical experience?" then I tell them to forget everything the civilian world taught them, as its not practical on the battlefield.

Although its help full, it ends up doing more harm than good in the long run.

Hopefully they dont forget everything, since they need the anatomy knowledge that is covered in Basic. Forgetting the EMT Basic skills is understandable.

 

[Deleted member 9101]

I did talk to a corpsman in my unit and was told CPR would be a big help instead of waiting and taking a corpsman from other casualties. Being in the marine corps with a family makes it very hard to take off time for a emt wilderness class or emt class. I would like a better understanding of the anatomy of trauma and treatment of more complicated injuries that can save a life. A live tissue course is about it for availability. I'm gonna have to read and teach myself on down time. As stated earlier I think I'm hooked. Thanks again for the input.

CPR is not used in combat. CPR is only used when every one else is treated and you have no one else needs to be treated.

 

[Deleted member 9101]

Hopefully they dont forget everything, since they need the anatomy knowledge that is covered in Basic. Forgetting the EMT Basic skills is understandable.

They really only need a extremely basic knowledge of anatomy, what they need to know is how to stop hemorrhage and package casualties for transport.

 

[jh504]

They really only need a extremely basic knowledge of anatomy, what they need to know is how to stop hemorrhage and package casualties for transport.

Understood. If he is developing a growing interest in emergency medicine though I would recommend going above and beyond a very basic knowledge. Most people don't care about how things work and I am sure in your CLS courses that is the majority. Keeping things simple, I am sure, is the most effective way for them.
He seems to be a little more interested than the majority though.

 

[ruditron]

CPR is not used in combat. CPR is only used when every one else is treated and you have no one else needs to be treated.

I think he is looking to expand on his knowledge outside of just BASIC combat triage....

Just because someone can perform the 3 basic skills to treat combat injuries does not make you perfectly proficient.

Any basic infantryman should have those skill sets but one who strives to better himself in all facets of medicine will always be learning new things especially outside of his own field of expertise.

so yes CPR and EMS courses eg.... will ALWAYS help in EVERY situation....more tools for the toolbox.:ylsmoke:

 

[Deleted member 9101]

i think he is looking to expand on his knowledge outside of just BASIC combat triage....

just because someone can perform the 3 basic skills to treat combat injuries does not make you medically proficient.

any basic infantryman should have those skill sets but one who strives to better himself in all facets of medicine will always be learning new things especially outside of his own field of expertise.

so yes CPR and EMT courses eg.... will ALWAYS help in EVERY situation....more tools for the toolbox.:ylsmoke:

Ya know what, I am still going to have to disagree. In my three deployments as a medic(two as medical NCOIC for an infantry unit) I have not once used CPR or the skills related to EMT-B/P in combat.

Saving a life in Combat is nothing like it is in the civilian world.
The first thing I tell some one when they boast about being a EMT-B or even P is to "leave it at home" ( I hold a current EMT-P, National and Florida) when they put on the uniform. If soldiers react to a causality as the EMT standards teach to treat a patient both of them would be put into a very bad situation.

Not to be an a@@ but leave the civilian medical training where it belongs... in the civilian world. It has no place on the side of the road at 0200 after an IED blast takes out a truck and you are taking fire from all sides.

 

[baca327]

I am trying to expand beyond basic combat trauma care. Its not always safe for a bird to land. So if there is one corpsman for x amount of vehicles and 3 get hit that's at least 9 casualties. If a casualty has no pulse and is not breathing I should wait for the corpsman to come up and perform CPR because I shouldn't know it? I should leave it to chance because I shouldn't learn. A tactical convoy moving supplies is much different than a grunt line. Your cargo is not a load of devils looking to get some but 12 pallets of MREs that don't shoot back. Yes we have air support but if it was me I would not give a damn who is trying to perform CPR. A casevac isn't as fast as a ambulance especially if fire superiority is not gained, also the first responders to a downed vic is NOT the corpsman. Or worse corpsman becomes a casualty..

 

[baca327]

i think he is looking to expand on his knowledge outside of just basic combat triage....

Just because someone can perform the 3 basic skills to treat combat injuries does not make you medically proficient.

Any basic infantryman should have those skill sets but one who strives to better himself in all facets of medicine will always be learning new things especially outside of his own field of expertise.

So yes cpr and emt courses eg.... Will always help in every situation....more tools for the toolbox.:ylsmoke:

i agree.......

 

[Deleted member 9101]

I am trying to expand beyond basic combat trauma care. Its not always safe for a bird to land. So if there is one corpsman for x amount of vehicles and 3 get hit that's at least 9 casualties. If a casualty has no pulse and is not breathing I should wait for the corpsman to come up and perform CPR because I shouldn't know it? I should leave it to chance because I shouldn't learn. A tactical convoy moving supplies is much different than a grunt line. Your cargo is not a load of devils looking to get some but 12 pallets of MREs that don't shoot back. Yes we have air support but if it was me I would not give a damn who is trying to perform CPR. A casevac isn't as fast as a ambulance especially if fire superiority is not gained, also the first responders to a downed vic is not the corpsman.

Look, I understand your desire, but CPR is not practical very in combat. If you want to learn it, its good to have..but more often than not if someone is not breathing or lacks a pulse on the battle field CPR is not going to help due to the nature of the injuries that cause those complications. If you stop to preform CPR you are obligated to continue until you are relieved by someone else.... thus taking you out of the fight and preventing you from helping multiple casualties. If you want to do CPR, then the area has to be secure, and no other casualties require assistance...then you can do it.

As for the pulse, you don't check that in the care under fire setting...never..no way...the thought shouldn't even cross your mind. You don't have time for that, and neither does he. Your ONLY concern is stopping massive hemorrhage and getting him some place out of the line of fire(not necessarily in that order). If a causality lacks a pulse, more often than not its due to fact that massive amounts of blood have been lost. If you want to take a pulse once the excrement stops flying... check the radial pulse... if its palpable.. good.. if not... move on unless you have been trained how to restore volume to a circulatory system.


Really, I am not trying to knock you... or dissuade you... but the harsh reality is people die in combat... If you want to save the guy who is on the ground, grab your weapon, return fire, and get him the hell out of there. Unless you have an aid bag stocked full of supplies and know how to use them very well... your best bet to save your buddies life it to get him to a higher level of care.

 

[ruditron]

 

[Deleted member 9101]

glad we both agree baca i guess we are just a breed above army standards in regards to learning and expanding on our capabilities.

Ya know what, I am threw with this topic. I have saved far too many soldiers and marines from the clutches of death to sit here and be insulted.