Off Grid Trailers
- Thread starter firnadlinh75
- Start date
4000lbsOfGoat
Well-known member
I know this post is a bit old but I just found it...
I've had mine out quite a few nights when the temp was as low as 22 (in Colorado, in the fall, in fact!).
It worries the heck out of me but so far no issues. I try to keep track of the expected overnight low but so far I've seen actual temps that were up to 10 degrees colder than the forecast in several places so sometimes I've had nights unexpectedly hit the low 20s when I've done nothing to prepare for it.
The biggest worry with these things is the water heater because it has the smallest passageways. Anything else is unlikely to freeze hard from just a few hours of sub-freezing temps overnight. If I expect temps below about 28 overnight then, just before going to bed, I'll run the hot water for a bit to heat up the unit. It's burning propane inside so it heats up quickly. Then I'll wrap a heavy flannel shirt around the water heater to try to keep that heat in (just be careful to keep it away from the cabin heater exhaust pipe!) Like I said, so far I've had no issues with anything actually freezing.
Cheers!
DRAX
Active member
Agreed, the water heater is the most likely part to get damaged and it has happened to a couple of people in the FB group. At least one brass "Gas-Water Valve" was cracked/deformed due to freezing. It's a cheap part, https://www.eccotemp.com/l5-gas-water-valve-assembly/, and the failure was the expansion of the two halves above the drain where the frozen water did the damage. Draining the water heater and getting as much water out of the lines as possible would definitely be better than doing nothing.
I'm close to pulling the trigger on an OGT Pando, could use some help. I'd be pulling it with a JKU Rubicon with just a small 1 inch body lift. I think the hitch height is approximately 13 inches, but I still have to measure.
Seems to me I'd have to get some sort of riser to connect my hitch to the trailer? How much of a rise height is too much before it becomes unsafe, if it does?
Also, at 2200 lbs that doesn't give me a lot of capacity before reaching the limit on my Jeep, is the pando too heavy to a JKU and would i be better off looking at the expedition or a different make? Any JKU owner who can weigh, so to speak, lol as to how it pulls behind their vehicle?
thanks for any help all!
Seems to me I'd have to get some sort of riser to connect my hitch to the trailer? How much of a rise height is too much before it becomes unsafe, if it does?
Also, at 2200 lbs that doesn't give me a lot of capacity before reaching the limit on my Jeep, is the pando too heavy to a JKU and would i be better off looking at the expedition or a different make? Any JKU owner who can weigh, so to speak, lol as to how it pulls behind their vehicle?
thanks for any help all!
DRAX
Active member
The Pando itself has a GVWR of 3,500LB so if you exceed the tow rating of the JKUR then you'll also be exceeding the capacity of the Pando itself.
Are you sure your hitch height to the center of the receiver is only 13"? That seems REALLY low. The trailer frame centerline is at 21 inches, which is roughly where you'd want the coupler to be, not the draw bar itself. I've seen some folks measure their stock Rubi hitch height and the center of the receiver on a stock Jeep is just over 20". I can't see how your receiver is only 13" off the ground. You need to re-measure.
The issue you're going to run into is hitch/tongue weight, these trailers are pretty tongue-heavy and if you don't install some higher rate springs or airbags then you will end up with the rear of your Jeep sagging due to the tongue weight. The listed factory tongue weight doesn't account for everything, it's the base trailer. Add a spare tire and mount and any gear forward of the trailer axle and that will increase the tongue weight of the trailer. There are a lot of folks towing these trailers with JKUR/JLUR without issue once the sag is addressed.
I'm guessing at the hitch height, I haven't actually measured it yet, Appreciate the help!
After selling them for a few years I’d recommend the expedition for a Jeep Wrangler due to weight and drivability. If you had a gladiator you could definitely do the pando.
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DRAX
Active member
Not sure I understand the reasoning here, both trailers are the same from the axle forward, the issue is going to be tongue weight and there is virtually no difference between the two in that regard. 290LB vs 300LB base, dry hitch weight between the Expo and Pando. Both trailers have a 3,500LB GVWR as well. Yes, the Pando as a higher base weight but a lot of that weight is rear of the axle and is why there's virtually no difference in tongue weight between the two. Expo or Pando, doesn't matter. Sag with one and you'll sag with the other. My $0.02.
Your probably right! Good thing I don’t sell them anymore since I was wrong with no reasoning here. All that time being wrong , well I guess I need to call up my old customers and apologize. Thanks !!
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DRAX
Active member
I was hoping you would explain your reasoning/experience as to why you felt the Expo was easier to tow but instead you're going to be butt-hurt and act like a child. Got it. While we're at it, how were you selling them? Did OGT used to have dealers in the US and then switch to direct-to-consumer? Serious question. I thought OGT was always direct-to-consumer, but I don't know their full history. Or are you going to take offense to me asking about that as well?
Probably best that you don't sell them, with an attitude like that it's a bad look for the brand.
I was hoping you would explain your reasoning/experience as to why you felt the Expo was easier to tow but instead you're going to be butt-hurt and act like a child. Got it. While we're at it, how were you selling them? Did OGT used to have dealers in the US and then switch to direct-to-consumer? Serious question. I thought OGT was always direct-to-consumer, but I don't know their full history. Or are you going to take offense to me asking about that as well?
Probably best that you don't sell them, with an attitude like that it's a bad look for the brand.
OGT has a team of sellers who are in the states. They are called location ambassadors and basically you help facilitate the sell from customers to the company and take delivery of the units at your place of business. Then you do a walkthrough with the customer and help answer their questions and take care of any warranty work needed for those units.
As for the difference in towing the two, it’s not the tongue weight that’s the issue for the Jeep’s it’s the overall weight. The specs they give are for a unloaded base trailer. By the time you load a pando with gear and water and anything extra like a rooftop tent and awning you will be maxed out on what the Jeep can handle.
And as for my attitude, it’s there due to people adding their .02 with no experience and setting new customers up for failure from day one. Unless you own a Jeep and have towed both trailers it’s best to stay in your lane and take advice from the ones who have already.
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DudeLePowSki
Member
I was hoping you would explain your reasoning/experience as to why you felt the Expo was easier to tow but instead you're going to be butt-hurt and act like a child. Got it. While we're at it, how were you selling them? Did OGT used to have dealers in the US and then switch to direct-to-consumer? Serious question. I thought OGT was always direct-to-consumer, but I don't know their full history. Or are you going to take offense to me asking about that as well?
Probably best that you don't sell them, with an attitude like that it's a bad look for the brand.
I was close to buying an OGT and it seemed like a simple inquiry to me. I thought it was the representatives job to inform their potential customers? I guess you're not allowed to ask a simple question anymore.
DRAX
Active member
Yeah, I know about ambassadors. You saying that you "sold" OGT products implied you were a dealer, thus why I was confused.
Again, both the Pando and Expo have a GVWR of 3,500LB. The Pando starts out with a higher base weight but as a result it has reduced payload capacity. If a Pando can max out a Jeep then so can the Expo, as I said. Tongue weight is actually the biggest issue and is the #1 problem new owners of these trailers have to contend with when towing with a Wrangler, Gladiator, Tacoma, 4Runner, etc. Just a few examples of Expos causing excessive sag.
Yeah, what do I know...not like I've towed with a JKUR in addition to my current vehicle or anything...or recently spent time with the OGT folks and other owners at Expo West recently...or have personally witnessed numerous people whose #1 issue that they didn't plan for when purchasing was the tongue-weight-induced sag (some examples above).
No complaints about the overall weight of the trailers, though. Only the sag that is often made worse due to all the gear they have in/on their tow vehicles or made worse by running a lift whose springs don't have a high enough spring rate to carry such a load.
Mayyyybe next time don't start with the attitude, especially if you don't know who you're talking to or their background.
OGT Ambassadors are owners that have signed up to show their trailer and answer questions from potential owners, they're expected to be knowledgeable about the products but if there are any questions that someone wants official answers for then the only way to get them is by contacting OGT directly. The base specs are listed on their website, but like any trailer the base weights aren't what owners will see once they receive the trailers. A lot of people don't seem to understand how their vehicle payload and tow ratings work, either, so when they load their vehicle up with people and gear often times they actually don't have enough payload capacity left for a trailer. For example, a 2017 JKUR has a payload capacity of around 1,087LB and a max trailer tongue weight rating of 350LB. A base Expo has a tongue weight of 290LB but closer to 400LB in reality isn't unheard of. So that already exceeds the hitch rating of 350LB. But let's say it doesn't. However, let's say you're a family of 4. Your combined weight is 600LB. 1087 - 600 = 487LB remaining payload. Hook up the trailer with a 400LB tongue weight and that drops down to 87LB left. Do "you" have more than 87LB of non-factory "stuff" in or on your vehicle? If so then you're overweight and it's likely to be obvious by the amount of sag in the rear suspension.
The actual tow and payload capacity for vehicles will change as you add people and gear to the tow vehicle. Some people know this, but the vast majority don't, and then you see them going down the road with their nose/headlights pointed towards the sky, their ass looking like it's dragging, and the driver wondering why they're having such a horrible experience.
The vast majority of tow vehicles, ESPECIALLY those that have been outfitted for overlanding, are going to run out of payload capacity/GVWR first. Anyone that wants to tow a trailer needs to sit down and figure out if their vehicle is actually capable of doing it first. The "max tow rating" and "max tongue weight rating" are the maximums, not actual.