Box Rocket
Well-known member
Starting your own "bro-fight" (as you call it) I see. :cough: hypocrisy
Still waiting for you to share any real first hand experience to back up your google search answers.
New Defender Rage/Hate Thread
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Still waiting for you to share any real first hand experience to back up your google search answers.
No I'm not. I am pointing out that he should explain how it can be done. That he should provide the actual evidence. That's not the same as the "bro-off" you wanted. You wanted me to ship my car so we could see which was better. Like a 13-yo. There is no hypocrisy at all from my side. I want him to come up with some evidence for his claims. To show how it is possible.
LOL, yes. When asked for how you can get around the problems caused by the wheels being connected, you first tried out a bunch of lies and then a bunch of distractions. Then a lie about you having already explained it, then you attempted a bro-off, and finally you asked for what you asked for above.
I asked you before how you solve the problems of unsprung weight and the problem of one wheel reacting everytime the other wheels react. You still haven't answered that. And I know for a fact that you will never do so, because you can't. It doesn't matter how much I reveal about myself. Your latest attempt to paint my answers as "google answers" is stupid at best. Let me explain:
If you think what I know is simply a google search away and that I rely on that, you could easily disprove me by actually googling something like "How to get rid of unsprung weight of solid axle", and do another search of "How to disconnect rigid axle" or some other searches like that.
So, I fear you're projecting when you accuse me of "google answers", when it is evident that you have done everything - including searches - in an attempt to avoid backing yourself into a corner.
So, I ask again:
How do you stop one wheel from reacting when the other does, while keeping them rigidly connected?
How do remove enough unsprung weight so it is at least comparable to an independent setup, while still being rigidly connected?
Box Rocket
Well-known member
Deflecting.
I'll keep waiting, but I won't hold my breath.
I'll keep waiting, but I won't hold my breath.
EricTyrrell
Expo God
You're asking the wrong questions, because you're trying to solve the wrong problems.
No I'm not. You're asking me to ignore real problems: Less unsprung weight is better than more. It is not good that one wheel reacts when the other is being moved.
Those are actual problems of solid axles. Solved with disconnecting the two.
roving1
Well-known member
Sorry too late. Already been, Opel, Ford, VAG, PSA.
The invite was tongue in cheek but it turns out it did have a point. Proving how naive you are about the auto industry. Pretending Europe and the US has some sort of vast divide with no common engineering language and no common parts supply chain, let alone the vast mergers of the last 5-10 years where the companies are literally are part of the same umbrella now.
But I mean you have picked up Bosch engineers from the airport in a pre-production vehicle to help root cause issues before right? I mean you are just so deep into the auto biz aren't you?
You are so over your head in this argument.
You truly are dishonest, aren't you. Anything to defend an indefensible position.
I am reasking the question. The one you claimed to have already answered. If it's so easy to do, a simply google search should provide you with the answer
You say you keep waiting, but that's as dishonest as you have always been in this discussion. I already explained why you should answer the question you lied about having answered.
Sure you have. Just like the "knowledge" that rubbed off on you.
But, please, do tell. Tell me all about those engineers from those companies that think that solid axles are better, and why corporate then want to go with the more expensive IS setup. Why don't you give me a list of cars (currently available) from those companies which comes with solid axles at the front. It has to be a majority, since a solid axle front is cheaper to make.
Nah, that might be too mean. How about you give me a list of 10 currently available cars with solid axle fronts?
I am not naive at all. You have shown yourself to lie and make up ********.
I am saying that solid axle vehicles are much more prevalent in the US than in Europe. US is beginning to make modern suspension designs in general, but it's a standing joke around here that when the mustang finally got independent suspension at the back 5 years ago or so, it was a big deal in the US. Here, we kind of expect supposed sports cars to have that.
,
You completely made that up in your head.
You realise you made that up because I mentioned that in Europe, there is no question about whether to go "IS" or "Solid axle", but a question about which IS is the best. That we actually expect cars to have IS and would balk at something with solid axles - especially at the front?
Apparently I know more than you. You may be able to wrench on a solid axle vehicle, or, as your latest claim: To chauffeur an engineer in a pre-production vehicle". Wooptidoo.
You sure the knowledge isn't rubbing off on you?
This is kind of a pointless argument. There are pros and cons to both systems. To answer the question of how do you solve the higher unsprung weight and having the wheels connected is you don’t. You accept those cons for increased articulation, strength, and modding ability or whatever other pro you chose. Same with IFS and IRS, you accept the cons for the pros of the system. But everybody is different and have different priorities. LR prioritized comfort, handling and other pros while trying to minimize the cons. Some people liked that, others didn’t. Imagine the uproar on ih8mud if the 300 series was unibody and IFS/IRS. I feel like this reaction is appropriate.
roving1
Well-known member
A fun video since Pilat pretty much is calling me a liar. Enjoy!
New video by Chris Lanctot
photos.app.goo.gl
Also you make all these aspersions about points I literally never made. You literally can't quote me on any of it because I literally never said it.
You make these huge inferences about people and posts and then miss the point, I don't mean don't agree with the point, I mean completely and utterly just fail to comprehend the idea being conveyed.
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A fun video since Pilat pretty much is calling me a liar. Enjoy!
New video by Chris Lanctot
LOL, I never called you a liar about you driving a prototype to pick up an engineer. I called you on it, as you seemed to think that chauffeuring an engineer - even in a "prototype" somehow meant that you must be knowledgeable about suspension.
That merely makes you a chauffeur. It says nothing about your engineering chops. Hell, although I don't think you are that low and the pecking list, but some floor sweeper with a driver's license could easily be asked to pick up someone from the airport. "here, take the keys, they're for this new chrysler sedan.".[/QUOTE]
roving1
Well-known member
[/QUOTE]
Yes because companies send a gringo all the way to Mexico and put me in a hotel for months to be a chauffer. There are not taxis or Uber here don't you know. ?
Whatever objective credibility I have about what I stated to be my job and my experience it's clearly better than yours.
Here's a YT link to some of my travels too.
Here's a link to some recent mods on my truck.
Just for fun why don't you post something that shows you have ANY connection to the auto industry or off-roading or overlanding. Any knowledge from or working on a personal car. Anything at all. Any suspensions you have worked on. Experience in the field driving different suspensions. Anything. Just for funsies? How about it?
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I really don't care at this point. You driving cars for a living doesn't really prove that you know anything about engineering. You even refuse to acknowledge unsprung mass is a problem, and that having one wheel react when the other is moving is a problem to handling. So please continue to show videos of you driving a car as if that proves anything.
I am also keen on those implied claims that engineers from big car companies prefer solid axles as the better solution, yet somehow gets overridden and independent suspension is chosen even if it's the more expensive design. You driving cars proves absolutely nothing.
I am also keen on those implied claims that engineers from big car companies prefer solid axles as the better solution, yet somehow gets overridden and independent suspension is chosen even if it's the more expensive design. You driving cars proves absolutely nothing.
roving1
Well-known member
I "refuse" to acknowledge something because me and you never specifically talked about unsprung mass. This is your problem you are lumping everyone together in every post you respond to.
If unsprung mass was the be all end all metric we wouldn't have giant heavy wheels on cars and trucks that are way bigger than needed to clear the brakes, but we do because it's a styling exercise that everyone does. So sure IFS has less unsprung weight and then we add that weight right back on for style. Then on top of that teams of engineers had to figure out how to reduce the NVH induced by the styling excercise of huge wheels and short sidewalls. Nothing happens in a vacuum which you never seem to grasp.
I am NOT an engineer. I am not a driver either. I assess , root cause, and report issues directly to Vehicle OEM and supplier engineering teems.
What is it you do again? What experience do you have... With anything?
Everyone is entitled to an opinion and so are you.
But you also have demonstrated zero credibility and very little ability to understand arguments.
Again, NOT AGREE. Just understand and even put the right argument with the correct poster.
Also I would like to offer a small apology. I honestly thought this was in the Fireside Chat. I would have not bothered engaging pretty early on if I had realized this was in the main LR forum.
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