New Defender Rage/Hate Thread

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EricTyrrell

Expo God
LR copied the Wrangler decades ago- the first one even rode on a Jeep chassis. They have never measured up in off-roading although, admittedly they have rode nicer, but even that is now being challenged with the much improved driving dynamics of the Wrangler.
Not sure if you've seen them side by side, but Defender was the king of off-road capability in the 80s and 90s. While YJ was rolling on leaf springs until 95, Defender had been on coils since 1983. Even when the TJ came out in 97, the Defender's longer forged control arms were far superior to the short little stamped arms found on the TJ. It wasn't until the JK and LR's pivot to London chic cars that Jeep pulled ahead.
 

Buliwyf

Viking with a Hammer
I'd take one of the longer TJ's. (unlimited model?) Over the original Defender any day. Add a Rubicon Express long arm kit, Yukon lockers, and 35's.





All the Defenders and Disco's that I know of, haven't been on the trails in ages. There's almost no LR's of any type, on our dirt roads over here.
 

35xj

Adventurer
...and yet again for your long post, you still don't answer the primary question of my original post. How does today's "Defender" align with the core maxim of overlanding of simplicity?

I agree they are not in the same class- LR is a nice riding vehicle that can do some off-roading....if that's what you want, there are better options that ride just as nice and have a better history of reliability and cost less.

If you want a vehicle that is the most capable out of the box 4x4 that rides 95% as nice as the LR there is really only once choice.

LR copied the Wrangler decades ago- the first one even rode on a Jeep chassis. They have never measured up in off-roading although, admittedly they have rode nicer, but even that is now being challenged with the much improved driving dynamics of the Wrangler.

They've always been close in reliability and durability, but now the Wrangler is trouncing LR in that regard as well.

Still waiting to read from an expert like yourself how a multi-chambered electronically controlled air-bag suspension aligns with simplicity in the field far removed from support while adventure-traveling.
Jlr copied the wrangler...... not entirely true. Taken inspiration from perhaps. And in a lot of ways eclipsed the jeep offerings of the time.
Coil springs/solid axles 1970rr classic. 1983 90/110.
Defender pickup (130) 1995.
So, in a lot of ways jeep took its inspiration (copied) jlr.
 

Buliwyf

Viking with a Hammer
Doesn't matter, don't care. Whoever puts together the better overlanding beast gets my cash. Right now, I see a Gladiator Rubicon on 37's in my future. Not the starbucks special.

Would be nice if the Gladiator had an engine or transmission to be proud of though. Maybe it will, by the time I'm back in that market.

Not sure what's wrong with Yj's on leafs. I loved them. Easy lifts. Easy GM 383 swaps. Roomy interior. Small and light. My old Yj would crush the Defender on tougher trails. Flexed better on those leafs than I've ever seen a Disco or Defender flex. Too bad that it spent 90% of it's life doing fullsize friendly roads and trails, and had to go.

1593350374175.jpeg
 
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Howski

Well-known member
You’re clearly confused on the intent of land rovers if you’re comparing to a lifted Jeep on 37’s. They’re not rock crawlers. They’re cruise comfortably at 80 on the highway and tackle easy to moderate trails in comfort. You keep referencing ‘Starbucks’ crowd which is where I see most lifted JK’s and JL’s. The same folks who put 35’s and light bars on to run gravel forest service roads twice a year
 

Buliwyf

Viking with a Hammer
Lot's of jeeps out there. Plenty are mall crawlers. My neighbors Glad is nearly stock on 37's. Drives fine, tires are a bit noisy. Mopar has a simple bolt on kit. Many Gladiators are running 37's stock, so any mild suspension kit will do. It's not like they need a 6" lift with scaffolding, like a GM fullsize does.

So trails that my fullsize already does? Doesn't sound like an upgrade. Going to the lake today, long way around. Won't see a single LR of any type getting dirty, is my bet. Pretty sure I'll see a Ramcharger, Ram, Super Duty, Zr2, and a dozen Jeeps at least. Hopefully plenty of bikes.

This is whut the Bronco, Taco, Zr2, Ranger, and LR have to compete with:
1593354023179.jpeg
 
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TexasTJ

Climbing Nerd
Everyone can driver what they want. If you want a Wheeler that can overland, Driver a Jeep. If you want an Overlander that can wheel, buy a Land Rover. But if you just want an Overlander in North American get a 1/2 ton pickup with a drop in.

THIS THREAD IS DUMB.

While my dream SUV is a Jeep LJ with skinny 33's I know it will never do the "car Camping" (I am Beginning to hate the term Overland) thing as well as my LR3. Driver what you love and enjoy or whats the point.
 
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DieselRanger

Well-known member
Doesn't matter, don't care. Whoever puts together the better overlanding beast gets my cash. Right now, I see a Gladiator Rubicon on 37's in my future. Not the starbucks special.

Would be nice if the Gladiator had an engine or transmission to be proud of though. Maybe it will, by the time I'm back in that market.

Not sure what's wrong with Yj's on leafs. I loved them. Easy lifts. Easy GM 383 swaps. Roomy interior. Small and light. My old Yj would crush the Defender on tougher trails. Flexed better on those leafs than I've ever seen a Disco or Defender flex. Too bad that it spent 90% of it's life doing fullsize friendly roads and trails, and had to go.

View attachment 594913
Hm, so you over built a jeep and then never used it to its full capability, eh?
 

Buliwyf

Viking with a Hammer
Kinda. My YJ was actually dirt cheap fun. SYE and driveshafts were the most painful expense.

Most of the trails lacked maintenance. Overgrew and disappeared. Switched to fullsize to carry a bike to use those trails again. And boat, and trailers, etc. etc.

An Suv that can't do fullsize things, or jeep things, is completely useless to me. I expected the defender to be more capable of than the previous version, and to compete well with the larger sized Jeeps. LR has already turned the Disco into a crossover, they didn't need to ruin this as well.

The future of LR?
1593357373966.jpeg
 
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