Need help with a truck/camper suspension upgrade

1stDeuce

Explorer
Nice looking setup, Ron!!
No surprise the rear is flat out mushed... If your truck scaled at 12,000 lbs, you've added almost 5000lbs to the base truck!! Given that your front is over GAWR too, I don't think your unit is too rear heavy... I'd not want the front to be much heavier...

I have a CCSB, which I put a 8.5' camper in. Lots hanging out the rear, and so the front doesn't carry much of the camper weight on my truck. I had the AirLift version of the airbags you have, and they worked OK on the road when plumbed independently. However, offroad, they were not ideal. I just made a change to eliminate the airbags and go to springs alone. (older 3500 spring pack merged with my 2500 pack...) I'm hoping for a good ride improvement, without too much sway.

Since your truck pretty much always has the camper, I would suggest having a custom set of springs made to properly carry the weight. This likely would mean getting rid of the overload leaf setup, as that was the factory way to get a nice empty ride, with the ability to carry more weight without too much sag. I should think a competent shop could re-use your top two leaves, and add 6 or so leaves under that to give proper ride height and ride quality. If you don't already have one, a large Hellwig anti-sway bar on the back is probably going to improve "handling" on the road...

That said, you're really taxing the chassis. It'll probably take it so long as your not too rough with it, but keep an eye on the forward bed mounts. With the 3-point mounting system you have, there will be a LOT of stress going into the forward mounts, and hence the middle of the frame... Not due to frame flex, but because those two mounts now must control the motion of the entire camper. With as little frame flex as these trucks have, if you find you do end up with issues, it may be a solution to just hard mount the whole flatbed, or at least add another set of mounts to the forward part of it to distribute the stress a bit more.

Good luck!!
 

OR2BAJA

Observer
Denver springs in Santa Ana, Ca. They are the best and the oldest in the business. They can build you exactly what you need.
 

pappawheely

Autonomous4X4
Denver springs in Santa Ana, Ca. They are the best and the oldest in the business. They can build you exactly what you need.

It's actually Deaver spring. I did research on them, National (now closed) and Atlas Spring in City of Industry, Ca. I went with Atlas because they do a lot of work on big class 8 trucks and unique commercial trucks. They also have the spring blanks made to their own specs from only north american steel. Putting Atlas springs on my truck was one of the best mods I've done. My head would hit the top of the cab when I hit bumps before I swapped springs.

Figuring out your center of gravity will not be exact but you might get close. http://hyperphysics.phy-astr.gsu.edu/hbase/cm.html





 
Last edited:

OR2BAJA

Observer
Thanks for the correction, been running Deaver's in multiple applications for a decade it's just that I didn't catch the autocorrection.
 

OR2BAJA

Observer
King or Fox shocks. Minimum of a 2.5 but preferably a 3.0 with the right custom valving it will definitely help.
 

Buliwyf

Viking with a Hammer
Firestone airbags and Daystar spring cups will do the trick, but sadly, that's not the correct choice. You're only 1500 over the weight of my work F350, but I'm still well within my weight specs. We're ordering stiffer springs for it.

I'd convert the truck over to DRW. The rear axle is tough. The truck is tough. The springs can be replaced. The tires are the weak link. Either find some hardcore military/fire department tires and wheels, or convert to DRW. And don't forget to seriously beef the front shocks so your GM isn't doing the classic rocking chair bit down the highway. I hate that about our fleet GM's.

But legally, it's still overloaded. Unless your state laws are like Florida and whatever weight you register the vehicle as, and pay the taxes for, is the weight it's now rated for legally. (not sure that would hold up in court if you were ever involved in a deadly accident)
 

Seabass

Idiot
Ronald,

Care to elaborate on this?

I think some folks missed this comment.

I didn't. I've had the firestone bags and custom springs at the same time. It worked nice. I just really liked the springs better. Especially if your heavy all the time. The bags on the particular application I was using actually helped my empty ride. I'd pump them up enough to carry the truck unloaded and it was pretty dang plush. Then when heavy I'd let the springs do the hard part and the bags just take the edge off. This guy has a swanky rig. I'm betting he can beef his springs up and be pretty happy. Will he have frame or other issues....maybe. Probably depends on how hard he uses it. If he's easy with it it, it could hold up a really long time. There's some really awesome heavy tires available these days. Duals would be super for the weight though. I've never had any major issues being over gross, but I've never been in a collision while over loaded either. Might get touchy if you did. That would really be my biggest concern. Trucks are well made these days. That Chevy could really surprise a lot of us in terms of longevity and durability, even loaded as heavy as it is with the right combination of parts. It's the dang liability issue if something ever happened in terms of an accident. We run several semi's in our feed business....you can guarantee that if we have an accident and are even one pound over what the truck is rated for we're gonna be homeless. Maybe I'm overreacting. Still say it's a dang sweet rig. And for what it's worth- if anybody knows how to pack a big custom camper it's IDa-SHO. Whatever he says IMO you can bank on.
 

IdaSHO

IDACAMPER
Oh I totally agree with the bags vs appropriate leaf pack.

Im right there as well. And have had bags before. Never again, for many reasons.

I was only bringing it back up to verify that the bags were indeed working for him, or not.
Seems that his problem, regardless of how overloaded he is, would very well be solved by those bags.


My primary concerns with just HOW overloaded is this, and in this order by importance/safety:

1. Wheels and tires.

You NEED more tire in the rear. Hell, you probably need more WHEEL in the rear.
Wheels have specific load ratings as well, regardless of the tires you put on them.
As an example, most 16" 8-lug alloy truck wheels have a rating of 3000-3600lbs each.
Id check to see what yours are actually rated at.
So with that said, as I mentioned before, you need at minimum a dually rear end.
Not only will it be more safe, but it will give your tires a chance at lasting more than a blink.
Running so close to their maximum load rating, I doubt youd see more than 25k out of a set.
So push to a dually rear. With your truck, that is as easy as a bed and axle swap.

2. Chassis and camper mounting.

I can see the rear center pivot mount on the truck, (and it looks great) but do you have a photo of the front setup?
With so much weight on that chassis, if the load isn't spread along a considerable length of those frame rails,
you can pretty much count on that chassis fatiguing and folding eventually.
3500 lbs is a lot to place in just 3 locations (with the majority placed on the front 2) on the chassis that was wasn't designed specifically for it.

3. Suspension

Why you came here right? :sombrero:
With so many safety concerns, I held back on a simple answer to your simple question until there was a bit more of an understanding of the situation.
Believe me, I run at or over max GVWR at times, but not by nearly 20% unless it is just crossing town with a pallet of sod or concrete in the bed.
With the desire and PLAN to keep this truck so overloaded indefinitely, I wanted to make sure that was understood.

So, with suspension, yes, your best bet is to go with a heavier leaf pack in the rear and some extremely stiff shocks. Your choice.
Lots like the expensive Bilstein 5100s, I do not have a local source and like to support my local businesses, so I went a different route.
I run KYBs, and I have had great experience with KYB Monomax with a heavy truck and camper.

Being so heavy, regardless of the comments I have made about bags, Im going to tell you to KEEP them and use them in conjunction with the heavier leafs.
With that said, you are definitely overloaded on the front as well, so maybe look into a set of front bags too.



That's all I've got for now.

Hope it helps.

And be safe.
 

IdaSHO

IDACAMPER
And for what it's worth- if anybody knows how to pack a big custom camper it's IDa-SHO. Whatever he says IMO you can bank on.

Im going to quote that, for good measure.

maybe even print it out and post it on the fridge ::friday:




Thank you SeaBass, BTW :ylsmoke:
 

rrliljedahl

Observer
Bilstein offers a 5100 series as well as a 4600 series. There is some talk elsewhere that the 4600 series is for heavy loads like a truck camper and the 5100 series is for lifted trucks going offroad. Comments?

Just checked on my rims and they are rated to 3600 pounds.
 

chilliwak

Expedition Leader
It's actually Deaver spring. I did research on them, National (now closed) and Atlas Spring in City of Industry, Ca. I went with Atlas because they do a lot of work on big class 8 trucks and unique commercial trucks. They also have the spring blanks made to their own specs from only north american steel. Putting Atlas springs on my truck was one of the best mods I've done. My head would hit the top of the cab when I hit bumps before I swapped springs.

Figuring out your center of gravity will not be exact but you might get close. http://hyperphysics.phy-astr.gsu.edu/hbase/cm.html






Some good looking springs there. Fraud:Wow1: springs are really weak from the factory.:violent-smiley-031::yikes::yikes::yikes:
 

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