Todd n Natalie
OverCamper
Exactly. You could have a million mile '96 Neon if you wanted to......
Is the FZJ80 worth it in today’s market?
- Thread starter Ozark_Prowler
- Start date
nickw
Adventurer
This one was impressive:
Irv Gordon, Guinness World Record Holder Who Put 3.2 Million Miles on His Volvo P1800, Has Died
He was 77.
www.roadandtrack.com
I watched a video of the story and I think he's basically re-built the car 2-3 times....I highly doubt Volvo designed the car with a service life more than std., the simple nature of of vehicles, just like the Rovers and 40's, 60's and 80's make it possible.
XJLI
Adventurer
This one was impressive:
Irv Gordon, Guinness World Record Holder Who Put 3.2 Million Miles on His Volvo P1800, Has Died
He was 77.
I watched a video of the story and I think he's basically re-built the car 2-3 times....I highly doubt Volvo designed the car with a service life more than std., the simple nature of of vehicles, just like the Rovers and 40's, 60's and 80's make it possible.
Yea, simple definitely make things easier. But it isn't impossible to go just as long with vehicles equipped with newer tech.. it just might take some slightly more expensive parts, and different kinds of tinkering. That Volvo guy is from my hometown, I saw it once or twice at local car shows.
phsycle
Adventurer
This one was impressive:
Irv Gordon, Guinness World Record Holder Who Put 3.2 Million Miles on His Volvo P1800, Has Died
He was 77.
I watched a video of the story and I think he's basically re-built the car 2-3 times....I highly doubt Volvo designed the car with a service life more than std., the simple nature of of vehicles, just like the Rovers and 40's, 60's and 80's make it possible.
Wow. In the rust belt, nonetheless.
nickw
Adventurer
That Volvo in the 60's was probably considered high tech at the time and in no way a viable care 25+ years down the road....
Ozark_Prowler
Active member
A lot of good info here, thanks for the input.
I'm working on the VCG/plugs and wires/hoses now.
Between Partsouq, McGeorge, and specialty outlets like Witsend, I haven't found OEM parts very hard to come by at all. I ordered NGK for the plugs.
Also @MOAK where did you get that they need a top end rebuild at the 150k interval? I've talked to several Cruiser mechanics and they told me the HG "issue" is mostly overblown for the 1fz, and that plenty of them go to 300k+ without being torn into. If you're really worried you could catch most of them with an oil/coolant analysis and a compression/leakdown test.
As for the service life, apparently the official Toyota specs are 186k miles X 3 rebuilds (per the FSM). There is a lot of disagreement on this however, as not even the most meticulous 80 series owners would tear down a perfectly running engine at 186k, which is in fact considered fairly low mileage by much of the 80 series community. Perhaps Toyota recommended this with harsh global environments in mind?
I'm working on the VCG/plugs and wires/hoses now.
Between Partsouq, McGeorge, and specialty outlets like Witsend, I haven't found OEM parts very hard to come by at all. I ordered NGK for the plugs.
Also @MOAK where did you get that they need a top end rebuild at the 150k interval? I've talked to several Cruiser mechanics and they told me the HG "issue" is mostly overblown for the 1fz, and that plenty of them go to 300k+ without being torn into. If you're really worried you could catch most of them with an oil/coolant analysis and a compression/leakdown test.
As for the service life, apparently the official Toyota specs are 186k miles X 3 rebuilds (per the FSM). There is a lot of disagreement on this however, as not even the most meticulous 80 series owners would tear down a perfectly running engine at 186k, which is in fact considered fairly low mileage by much of the 80 series community. Perhaps Toyota recommended this with harsh global environments in mind?
Arktikos
Explorer
No, it's 300,000 km X3 before a rebuild, so over 500K miles.
nickw
Adventurer
186k miles = 300k km
nickw
Adventurer
If that is true, my guess is this is where the 'designed to last' 500k miles probably came from. They engines are 'designed' to be serviceable where most are not and from memory Toyota had OEM oversized pistons in the supply chain to enable this....which we'd never see with a domestic rig. With that said, 186k miles is not much for an engine, domestic or otherwise....but knowing Japanese, it was conservative....but as you point out, HIGHLY dependent on environment. They may of had a FSM for US specific where miles were assumed to be a mix of highway and city....186k/35-40mph average (based on some research) = 5300 - 4600 hours, call it 5,000 which seems about right for a gas engine, diesels (like the 5.9 Cummins) is generally considered a 10,000 hour engine.
As good as the modern cruisers are, I highly doubt they have a rating like this due to lack of engineered 'serviceability' like the older ones do.....
Arktikos
Explorer
That's right, and 300,000 KM X 3 = 900,000 KM. That's about 550K miles, yes? This figure is per Beno, Cruiser guru on IH8MUD.
Ozark_Prowler
Active member
Right, but that's assuming two rebuilds at the 300k km interval. And then some claim a new top end is needed every 150k or so, as was stated earlier in this thread. Then there's the whole "25 year service life" mantra. It can get pretty confusing.
I mean, for the 70 series used in Canadian salt mines, Toyota estimates a service life of around 3 years. If an 80 series was used for leisurely highway trips and tooling around the suburbs, it might last 400k miles before any engine work is needed (if one could afford the petrol). If used as a mining truck, bush basher etc., it might indeed require a rebuild at 200k or earlier. Especially with the lower quality fuel in some parts of the world.
Arktikos
Explorer
OK, I guess you guys are right. Well, it seems too low for a Cruiser I-6 to me.
nickw
Adventurer
That's why I've been trying to equate it to hours...hours are the only thing that really makes sense to a certain extent. I bet those mine trucks see on average 8 hrs a days x 365 = 3000 hrs/year or over that (3) years about 10,000 hrs.....which is about right for a diesel, but I'd guess the rest of the drivetrain is just as trashed and the engine.
I think what the cruisers having going for them is they are low power, low compression and deal well with abuse well, which is a blessing and a curse.....they probably should be rebuilt in that 200-300k mile range for optimal performance and longevity but they continue to operate well and fade very slowly which I think kind of lulls you into thinking nothing is 'required'. I don't know anybody outside of a few die hard cruiser heads that rebuilds engines with OEM parts, typically it's junk yard engine swap...more cost effective...not to mention I wouldn't trust any shop, I'd seek out a proper cruiser shop which just adds to the cost of logistics....
I looked into getting my FJ40 engine re-built with the best parts available, this was 10+ years ago and it was $6k, I could have done a LS swap for about the same....
lugueto
Adventurer
If they're worth it is a subjective topic. The 80 is a legend in itself, an icon, and will be always held close by their owners, Toyota fans and overlanders/offroaders. To us, it will always be worth it. any one of us would kill to have one and would be perfectly happy owning one. To us? Sure. Definitely worth it.
Are they worth it from a practical point of view? Nope, not these days. Too expensive to run, really, more so if you baby it due to the iconic value you might give it.
We can't say these vehicles are unreliable. All vehicles have their issues, but to see one running 25 years after their release is proof that they're reliable. There's tons of reliable rigs. 80s can stand abuse and rough conditions, and they're still there. People spend over a decade travelling overloaded through rough roads and they're still there. Definitely reliable. Definitely maintenance intensive, but so is any 25yr old vehicle. I agree that reliable doesn't mean that it'll withstand negligence, as mentioned, nothing will last without proper care. Reliable means it'll keep on going forever if you take care of it, regardless of how you use it.
These days I wouldn't even consider buying one as my travel vehicle. Mainly because I feeI would have to spend too much money on creature comforts, maintenance and fuel. But I wouldn't hesitate to buy one as a sort of nostalgic collectors car. I would love to use one for light leisure trips and what not.
Are they worth it from a practical point of view? Nope, not these days. Too expensive to run, really, more so if you baby it due to the iconic value you might give it.
We can't say these vehicles are unreliable. All vehicles have their issues, but to see one running 25 years after their release is proof that they're reliable. There's tons of reliable rigs. 80s can stand abuse and rough conditions, and they're still there. People spend over a decade travelling overloaded through rough roads and they're still there. Definitely reliable. Definitely maintenance intensive, but so is any 25yr old vehicle. I agree that reliable doesn't mean that it'll withstand negligence, as mentioned, nothing will last without proper care. Reliable means it'll keep on going forever if you take care of it, regardless of how you use it.
These days I wouldn't even consider buying one as my travel vehicle. Mainly because I feeI would have to spend too much money on creature comforts, maintenance and fuel. But I wouldn't hesitate to buy one as a sort of nostalgic collectors car. I would love to use one for light leisure trips and what not.
I love my 80.
Someone near the beginning of this thread said 8-10k was a high number for baselining. Heh. I wish. I'm going to be close to 20k when I finish.
I do all my own work. All I have left is the gearbox. I rebuilt or replaced everything including the interior. The vehicle was over 40k new, now its 25 years old so, yea 26k (including what I paid for it) is a deal for me.
Someone near the beginning of this thread said 8-10k was a high number for baselining. Heh. I wish. I'm going to be close to 20k when I finish.
I do all my own work. All I have left is the gearbox. I rebuilt or replaced everything including the interior. The vehicle was over 40k new, now its 25 years old so, yea 26k (including what I paid for it) is a deal for me.