Flexopower 444 lithium

[Kneeboarder1025]

After using it to run my CPAP as a test ( since that is the primary reason I got it) I've managed to run it for 4 nights averaging 6 hrs a night, though the first couple of nights I forgot to put the CPAP into low power mode, which shuts-off the humidifier and heated hose, among other things. This morning the 0-20% light was flashing when I woke up but no Low alarm buzzer and my CPAP was still on. I plugged it in to recharge this morning. Since I know this forum would like numbers and data, I'll try to keep a record of times I have the unit turned on and powering the CPAP - and I'll re-measure the amps my CPAP is drawing - the tricky part will be guessing how efficient the inverter is. Won't be as applicable as running a 12VDC fridge, but its what I have and ultimately why I bought a powerpack with built-in inverter anyway.

 

[kmroxo]

Nice, glad it is working out for your goals.

 

[john61ct]

What is the watt-hour rating?

Not in this niche they often inflate Ah by using the nominal voltage of a single internal cell, in this case 3.7V, rather than @12V which should be standard.

Note an Ah-counter like "Watt's Up" will give an objective measure.

The load test does not need to be at a constant 20-hour rate, as with lead banks, since the Peukert coefficient for lithium chemistries is so close to 1.0

Good way to see Ah per 24 hours for devices with wildly varying draws, like a fridge's cycling rates fluctuate with many variables.

 

[Rivers2run]

I just bought one, this is a fantastic price compared to goal zero and other models. It will be nice to have some back up and additional portable power. 444 watt hours

 

[john61ct]

Ah yes, 444 Wh at 3.7V = Wait for it. . .

" 120,000 mAh "

aka 37 Ah at the standard 12V.

So say you don't want to wear it out too fast, 80% usable is 30Ah.

Comparable to 60Ah in a lead battery, which in quality deep cycle would be $60-70. But lots bigger, heavier and need closer attention to get 5-8 years use lifetime.

Value of the ancillary plugs, inverter, charge converter etc depends how closely they match your needs.

 

[dreadlocks]

why are these lil banks always so limited on charge current? 6.2A charge if I read that right? Lithium of this size should be capable of 15-20A, otherwise your paying lithium prices but leaving one of the biggest benefits off the table, really quick recharge times.. that makes lower capacity a lot more tolerable when you can go from 10% to 100% in an hour or two without spending all day on the road or seeking sunlight.

Saw the same thing with my darn smartphone, now that I can charge it >1% a min.. having a battery that can go days on end no longer seems all that important.

 

[Rivers2run]

I have a dual battery set up with odyssey batteries but I wanted this for back up and portable power. I wanted the lightweight and portability, plus having a small inverter is helpful.

 

[dstefan]

Company http://www.wanmabattery.com/eng/company.asp

Chemistry N:MC aka INR or LiNiMnCoO2

Probably a pack of 18650s inside.

More mainstream examples: Sony (now Murata) VTC5, LG HE2, Samsung 25R

Higher energy density than LFP, but much lower lifespan.

If used at high C-rates, and allowed to draw down to BMS cutoff each cycle, might get say 300-600 cycles.

And much more at risk of "unexpected thermal runaway events"

Any chance you can elaborate on the thermal events? Been wondering how risky the various
Lithium formulations are in the AZ/Southwestern heat. I’ve seen some operating range specs up to 140°F, but the inside of a closed vehicle in the summer sun can easily exceed that. Also any idea how much lower lifespan? I thought these were LiPo, but sounds like not?

 

[dreadlocks]

those are the ones that if physically damaged start a fire that cant really be put out.. if yeh ever see a lil smoke come out you got seconds to throw it as far as it can or it'll go all samsung on you.

 

[john61ct]

To the point that even when brand new and well matched, if both high C rates and high ambients,

likely need an engineered active-cooling Thermal Management System.

Unless you're not at all risk averse, just you alone driving around off-road in the desert competing for a Darwin award.

But if C-rates are kept well below say .2-3C, and kept cooler in the living space, "big bad boom" less likely.

But personally between value for money and safety, LFP is a much better choice.

 

[Outdoorsben]

I got one a week or two ago and have been running various tests. Here's what I came up with so far.

First Test. Controlled environment (house) running 31qt BlackForrest Fridge.
28hrs on AC figure AC loses what 10%-15% from the inverter.

Second Test. In my Jeep in New England Spring.
72hrs on DC. Got an E1 cutoff for voltage. Could have gone slightly further if swapped from DC to AC.

Third Test. In my Jeep in New England Spring with charging while driving.
108hrs on DC with charging while driving. Average commute time to work is 12-15minutes each way.

 

[kmroxo]

I'm ready to add a solar panel. The Lithium444 has a built in MPPT charge controller so I'm pretty sure I can get a panel without one. I found a Lensun 100 watt folding panel with MC4 connectors. If I get that, can I just get a MC4 to Anderson adaptor and plug it right in? That is what it seems to me, but I'm trying to confirm. I did send an email to Flexopower USA as well.

 

[dreadlocks]

I just covered my panel up with a big piece of cardboard and a blanket, then cut the MC4 off, crimped on Andersons directly to the panel and gave it a shrink wrap boot.. then got a spool of wire with andersons every ~30ft so I just pull out as much as I need.

 

[kmroxo]

I just covered my panel up with a big piece of cardboard and a blanket, then cut the MC4 off, crimped on Andersons directly to the panel and gave it a shrink wrap boot.. then got a spool of wire with andersons every ~30ft so I just pull out as much as I need.

Which panel? What gauge wire did you use? Are you using this with a Flexopower?

 

[dreadlocks]

no I've got a much bigger Lithium setup thats all hardwired.. none of what I did would be applicable to you.. but you can get a crimper that will do andersons fine at harbor freight and make your own cables easy enough.. MC4 are not really made for repeated connect/disconnects.. they are connect once and probably never need a disconnect again kinda connector and have poor wear characteristics, unlike Andersons.. and having adapters just adds points of failure and can be lost easy, leave the dongles to Apple products.

I used marine gauge tinned wiring, ran the gauge through a drop calculator for my longest length and picked it based upon acceptable losses (went with 12awg, for 5A @ 60V), my last setup I used normal Red/Black ZIP wire and I had a few segments get damaged pretty badly from the weather over time... like I cut em in half and could see cancer in the middle of a 15ft cable.