Diesel Phasing Out?

[billiebob]

What I'm hoping to see is professional truckers taking a stand on this. Refuse to enter California, period. And see how long the ban lasts. How many 18 wheelers are NOT powered by diesel?

India did this 10 years ago, total ban on diesel in many cities with air quality problems. The solution was conversion of old diesels to Natural Gas. Simple, kinda cheap, definitely cleaner. If India with 4 times our population can do it in a year or two, We can do it too once the idiots who fight every change in status quo are shut down.

These were all tiny diesels, now they are all CNG.



So if you own a diesel RV, ya might have to convert to compressed natural gas.
They run better, quieter and zero smell. Even cheaper to run since filtering diesel fuel is a major expense and CNG is clean.

 

[Explorerinil]

I’ve been seeing allot of gas blue bird school buses, I read that blue bird is using the 7.3 ford for their new generation of buses with a nat gas option.

Diesel is becoming cost prohibitive to own with maintenance costs and huge repair costs. It’s basically pointless to own a new diesel truck unless you tow allot.

 

[Explorerinil]

What I'm hoping to see is professional truckers taking a stand on this. Refuse to enter California, period. And see how long the ban lasts. How many 18 wheelers are NOT powered by diesel? I'm thinking the railroads would support this as I understand their locomotives are also now under attack from the Ban Fossil Fuels crowd.

Don't get me wrong - I would love to have a truck like my Dodge/Cummins dually with a powerplant that can pull like a freight train and travel 600 miles on a fillup, all without the Cummins engine noise. And I'd love a side by side that was totally silent - only noise would be the sound of the tires on dirt and yet run 14 hours without fueling. But such vehicles are NOT available yet.

I don’t see companies or truckers refusing to enter the countries largest economy with several large shipping ports. Someone refuses to do there job, they will get fired and replaced.

 

[blacklbzbeauty]

We can do it too once the idiots who fight every change in status quo are shut down.

Easy there big fella. Calling people names shows a lack of intelligence, lack of a logical fact based argument, and most of all is no way to win friends and influence people. Assuming that is your goal and not just shutting them down.

 

[billiebob]

Easy there big fella. Calling people names shows a lack of intelligence, lack of a logical fact based argument, and most of all is no way to win friends and influence people. Assuming that is your goal and not just shutting them down.

anyone who only wants to protect the status quo is less than intelligent, I have no problem being honest. The fact based arguement has been well made around the world and most countries are embracing the change, USA included, but there are somevincredibly vocal individuals and organization fighting to keep their gravy train running. Sorry, but they are dinosaurs who only confuse their followers..... ok dinosaurs, likely more intelligent than idiots. They know exactly what they are doing and why $$$$.

 

[deserteagle56]

These were all tiny diesels, now they are all CNG.

This says it all. Tiny diesels.

How is a trucker pulling 80,000 lbs - or even 120,000 lbs in some cases - going to pull that much weight with a CNG engine? I drove a propane-powered vehicle for 32 years. When it comes to energy levels of fuel, diesel is at the top, gasoline is next (1/3 less than diesel), then propane, then CNG. Pulling a lot of weight means big displacement diesels putting out massive amounts of torque at low rpms. No current CNG/propane, or even gasoline, engine can do that. Electric motors can...so maybe a CNG engine powering a generator, the way a diesel electric locomotive engine works?

 

[86scotty]

I don’t see companies or truckers refusing to enter the countries largest economy with several large shipping ports. Someone refuses to do there job, they will get fired and replaced.

not trying to be argumentative but you don’t know much about trucking. There are tens of thousands of small trucking companies and owner operators in this country. I am one. I drive a newer tractor with modern emissions and still choose to stay out of CA, and anywhere else I want to stay out of, for whatever reason.

I can make money anywhere and I don’t go places that I don’t agree with. Most company guys will go anywhere though, they don’t care. The big mega companies can service CA.

There are well north of one million commercial tractor trailers rolling around this country and a lot more than you think are small operators who vote with their feet, so to speak.

 

[blacklbzbeauty]

not trying to be argumentative but you don’t know much about trucking. There are tens of thousands of small trucking companies and owner operators in this country. I am one. I drive a newer tractor with modern emissions and still choose to stay out of CA, and anywhere else I want to stay out of, for whatever reason.

I can make money anywhere and I don’t go places that I don’t agree with. Most company guys will go anywhere though, they don’t care. The big mega companies can service CA.

There are well north of one million commercial tractor trailers rolling around this country and a lot more than you think are small operators who vote with their feet, so to speak.

Not to mention the huge issue of driver shortages whether mega or small operators. These men and women are critical to our supply chain and way of life as we know it.

 

[Lovetheworld]

lack of a logical fact based argument

Yes everybody just reacts like it is a stupid idea to ban diesels, and just don't go there. Well that is a nice factual argument, and I am sure your diesel smells like flowers.

Old diesels pollute densely populated areas. So it makes sense to ban them.
You can talk about natural gas trucks or electric trucks, but it already helps to just use newer trucks with cleaner emissions.
Talking about how much lbs you need to pull and it won't work with natural gas is irrelevant, use a newer diesel truck.

Don't want to go to CA? Sure, mission accomplished, the older diesel vehicles are not coming.

But I am sure you will all find it BS, and that there has been no engine becoming cleaner in the past 20 years.
Sometimes I don't get you US guys. Lots of trouble about VW diesel fraud, which made sense, they were cheating. And then you have pickup trucks which don't have to comply to any of those rules because it is a different class.

 

[JaSAn]

Those of you that think that just banning older diesels are the answer forget that there are people that are affected. I know a number of truck drivers and over half are independent. And guys that are driving the older diesels are in the lower half of the economic spectrum. The only solution I see here is punishment: You are going to be frozen out of lucrative markets <or> you must submit to corporate masters <or> become a slave to a banker.

Maybe before we label someone as mentally defective or reactionary we should 'walk a mile in their moccasins'. Others don't come at a problem with your life experiences or beliefs. And all of us will react negatively to anything that hurts our families and friends.

We as a society should be incentivizing people who want to work, instead the only solutions I see are 'the beatings will continue until the environment improves'.

 

[Porkchopexpress]

Sometimes I don't get you US guys. Lots of trouble about VW diesel fraud, which made sense, they were cheating. And then you have pickup trucks which don't have to comply to any of those rules because it is a different class.

Newer diesel trucks have to comply with emission standards just like cars. Our emission standards are so strict that our new diesels can't even run on the fuel in most other countries because of the sulfer content. Maybe if you come down off your high horse you will get US guys better.

 

[Lovetheworld]

Newer diesel trucks have to comply with emission standards just like cars. Our emission standards are so strict that our new diesels can't even run on the fuel in most other countries because of the sulfer content. Maybe if you come down off your high horse you will get US guys better.

Which high horse?
I still own an old diesel 4x4 which is not allowed in dozens of cities in Europe, including the city I used to live in. But I don't complain about it.

And the Euro 5 and 6 diesels that are sold here for a while now are horrible for proper overlanding outside of Europe, fuel quality is too low.

But yeah, lets lower the standard to the lowest standard that works for everybody so nobody needs to change or is affected. That way at least we are sure we never make any progress.

That is the whole thing with diesels. You constantly have to choose between fuel efficiency and lower emissions, it is always a fight. Reliability of diesels is also going out, because they became so complicated due to all the emissions stuff.
Then people say, lets remove the emissions stuff and have a better running engine. But you got dirty emissions again.

 

[Porkchopexpress]

Which high horse?

The one where you condescend an entire country.

 

[Lovetheworld]

The one where you condescend an entire country.

Ah yes, saying that I sometimes fail to understand you guys is condescending what way?

Anyway, lets stay with a factual disccussion and I am happy to hear any arguments against what I wrote.

For example, I actually preferred the US car emission standards to those of the EU, because the EU already lets diesel cars emit more than petrol cars. You can bring in technical arguments that it is more difficult to make a diesel cleaner, but the point of the legislation is that there should be clean cars on the road.
And even if diesel cars were allowed to emit more than petrol, they still needed to cheat emission tests

 

[Deleted member 9101]

This says it all. Tiny diesels.

How is a trucker pulling 80,000 lbs - or even 120,000 lbs in some cases - going to pull that much weight with a CNG engine? I drove a propane-powered vehicle for 32 years.

I see CNG powered class 8 trucks on the road almost every day and they have no problem keeping up with traffic.