Converting to manual locking front hubs
- Thread starter kmacafee
- Start date
billiebob
Well-known member
Sure from this summer.....
Stray trailer tire hits, kills motorcyclist outside of Revelstoke, B.C. | Globalnews.ca
"The tire bounced into oncoming traffic, narrowly missing an eastbound motorcycle but struck the driver of a second Harley Davidson motorcycle," RCMP said in a press release.
globalnews.ca
PS.... the wheel departed the trailer..... I don't think the why has been answered. But it was not a commercial unit.... it was something you or I might be towing..... and only news because it was a fatality..... how often does it happen without notice.
Maintenance is key. Paying a professional mechanic for annual maintenance might be a good investment.
Idasho and I tend to disagree often but it is more Idasho thinks the worst is unlikely to happen.... I think the worst is inevitable.
I love what he does. have full faith in how he does it,,,,,, but I know few have the ability to do it.... and most will fail to maintain it or watch for failures as they develop.
"have you ever seen".... yes, far too often.... which explains why I no longer volunteer for vehicle extrication. I have held too many dying bodies.
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UglyViking
Well-known member
Outside of the additional maintenance of having to grease the "free spin hubs", MPG gain (if any), and the other items discussed, I'd think the biggest win for the Dynatrac kit would be in their strength for larger tires, more negative offset than factory, and "hard" off-roading no?
I see a lot of discussions around OEM bearings failing with the KFC bucket wheel crowd due to the high negative offset they run. The OEM bearings are positioned very close to each other, where as the Dynatrac kit has much greater separation. My guess would be that folks running a 0 or negative offset with 37" tires or larger and doing a moderate amount of offroading would likely see longevity benefits from the Dynatrac hubs no?
I see a lot of discussions around OEM bearings failing with the KFC bucket wheel crowd due to the high negative offset they run. The OEM bearings are positioned very close to each other, where as the Dynatrac kit has much greater separation. My guess would be that folks running a 0 or negative offset with 37" tires or larger and doing a moderate amount of offroading would likely see longevity benefits from the Dynatrac hubs no?
Metcalf
Expedition Leader
Depends on the unit bearing......dodge and jeep maybe....99-04 ford maybe....05+ ford nope.
Most unit bearings will stand up to a LOT more than a moderate amount of off-roading. You might have to replace them at 50-100k miles instead of 200k miles. You can buy a lot of unit bearings ( anywhere ) for the cost of one conversion kit ( that uses special parts ). In my experience, if you are having issues with unit bearings, you are probably going to be having issues with stuff like balljoints or the overall strength of the knuckle/axle housing too.
craig333
Expedition Leader
I had one shop refuse to replace a unit bearing. Said they didn't have the specialized tools. Not the first place I heard that. If they are truly user serviceable in the backcountry for a guy who can turn a wrench but isn't a mechanic then maybe I made a mistake. I carry spare wheel bearings.
Btw, I had a bearing failure on a 1975 dodge 2wd PU. Took out the spindle also. I was dumb enough to touch it and burn my hand. Good thing I had an ice chest full of ice in the bed
Btw, I had a bearing failure on a 1975 dodge 2wd PU. Took out the spindle also. I was dumb enough to touch it and burn my hand. Good thing I had an ice chest full of ice in the bed
ramblinChet
Well-known member
Please provide a list of the specialized tool which you are speaking of. I have replaced unit bearings on various vehicles with simple hand tools. You will remove more nuts taking your wheel off compared to how many nuts and bolts are required to remove a unit bearing. It's pretty darn simple, lol.
tacollie
Glamper
I did both mine in drive way. No special tools required.
Metcalf
Expedition Leader
I had one shop refuse to replace a unit bearing. Said they didn't have the specialized tools. Not the first place I heard that. If they are truly user serviceable in the backcountry for a guy who can turn a wrench but isn't a mechanic then maybe I made a mistake. I carry spare wheel bearings.
Btw, I had a bearing failure on a 1975 dodge 2wd PU. Took out the spindle also. I was dumb enough to touch it and burn my hand. Good thing I had an ice chest full of ice in the bed
I've never seen any 'special tools' required for a unit bearing....maybe a larger than normal socket or a set of beefy snap ring plyers. I think they where blowing you off. You need more special tools to replace a normal wheel bearing generally speaking.
85_Ranger4x4
Well-known member
Some require a shop press to press the bearing out of the knuckle. Which of course requires removing the knuckle from the vehicle. Shouldn't be an issue for any shop but is kind of a PITA to do on a trail... but usually a bearing will complain a long time before it comes apart.
Hands down I would rather have old school bearings than unit bearings especially the press together bs. Aftermarket bearings... off hand not so much. If they use common bearings/seals etc maybe pending deeper research but I don't what stuff two weeks from anywhere.
Metcalf
Expedition Leader
If your junk is rusted together, it will cause issues with either system. You MIGHT be able to approach one issue slightly different, but the 'spindle' has to come off to do pretty much any common off-road repair in the front axle ( axle or diff repairs ). It doesn't matter if that spindle is part of the unit bearing or a stand alone part. Personally, I am WAY more worried about popping a front axle than having a wheel bearing go bad.
Next time you have your stuff apart, smear a bit of anti-seize on the mating surfaces, problem solved.
Not HAVING to disassemble the entire wheel bearing assembly in the middle of a mud puddle to get deeper into the axle has some upsides over the traditional system. When I designed the disc brake conversion for my old jeep, I did it in a way that I could treat the spindle/bearing/hub assembly as a unit bearing if I wanted for that very reason. I can remove the lug nuts, slip the rotor off the bearing hub, and then access the 6 spindle stud nuts. That allows me to pull the entire thing including the axle shaft as a sub-assembly.
Next time you have your stuff apart, smear a bit of anti-seize on the mating surfaces, problem solved.
Not HAVING to disassemble the entire wheel bearing assembly in the middle of a mud puddle to get deeper into the axle has some upsides over the traditional system. When I designed the disc brake conversion for my old jeep, I did it in a way that I could treat the spindle/bearing/hub assembly as a unit bearing if I wanted for that very reason. I can remove the lug nuts, slip the rotor off the bearing hub, and then access the 6 spindle stud nuts. That allows me to pull the entire thing including the axle shaft as a sub-assembly.
85_Ranger4x4
Well-known member
Not spindle, knuckle. Bearing is just a bearing and is pressed into the knuckle. You press the hub out of the bearing the bearing out if the knuckle and then the new bearing into the knuckle and the hub into the bearing. It's great fun.
The bolt on wheel bearings are not bad but cost a lot more.
Before I did the axle swap on mine I just repacked the bearings when I did brakes. I got the truck in 2000 and did the axle swap in 2019. Never had to replace a thing aside from seals which are cheap.
I get about 5 years out of unit bearings in my F-150.
Generally a rural dd setting.
Now that I do more offroading I repack after any deep water when I get home and I like knowing exactly what is going on in there. I put new bearings in it 19 and they are still running great.
No $150+ "surprise!"
The bolt on wheel bearings are not bad but cost a lot more.
Before I did the axle swap on mine I just repacked the bearings when I did brakes. I got the truck in 2000 and did the axle swap in 2019. Never had to replace a thing aside from seals which are cheap.
I get about 5 years out of unit bearings in my F-150.
Generally a rural dd setting.
Now that I do more offroading I repack after any deep water when I get home and I like knowing exactly what is going on in there. I put new bearings in it 19 and they are still running great.
No $150+ "surprise!"
Metcalf
Expedition Leader
That sounds like a terrible system.....and not a typical system for a normal 4wd vehicle.
Historically, most older 4wd vehicles where constructed with a spindle that bolted to the outer knuckle. The wheel bearings ride on the spindle and the races are replaceable in the bearing hub. A more modern unit-bearing system just combines all those things.
IdaSHO
IDACAMPER
All this nonsense about swapping bearings on the trail is a non-issue. Traditional taper bearings simply dont fail as quick as a unit bearing. If they fail at all on the trail, they have been ignored for a very long time.
As mentioned, the bearing retainers on a unit bearing are plastic. When it fails, it has the potential to do it with style. Simply not the case with traditional bearings.
Specifically to off road, moisture, etc…. Anyone that knows anything about a “sealed” bearing knows the seals are far from SEALED. Every unit bearing that fails will have contaminated and or lack of grease due to this. And once its contaminated, you are SOL. Again, not the case with traditional bearings.
Rust? Yeah, its hell for the bearing to knuckle connection. Unless you are a so-cal flatlander, the bearing will be frozen to the knuckle in short order. As in, just a few years. Unit bearings do often require the removal of the bearing and knuckle to toss on a (very large) press. That means you are trying to destroy balljoints and steering components to get if off. Once again, not the case with traditional bearings. A quick shot of grease and retorque doesnt even require removing the wheel. Even if you are going all the way down to races, still dont have to remove the spindle. And in a pinch all you need is a hammer and a few punches to do so.
Around here (far from so-cal) its pretty routine for unit bearings to go in less than 75k. Lots of gravel roads, snow, ice, deicer…. Rough roads and contamination. All plays into it. And they simple do not last.
As mentioned, the bearing retainers on a unit bearing are plastic. When it fails, it has the potential to do it with style. Simply not the case with traditional bearings.
Specifically to off road, moisture, etc…. Anyone that knows anything about a “sealed” bearing knows the seals are far from SEALED. Every unit bearing that fails will have contaminated and or lack of grease due to this. And once its contaminated, you are SOL. Again, not the case with traditional bearings.
Rust? Yeah, its hell for the bearing to knuckle connection. Unless you are a so-cal flatlander, the bearing will be frozen to the knuckle in short order. As in, just a few years. Unit bearings do often require the removal of the bearing and knuckle to toss on a (very large) press. That means you are trying to destroy balljoints and steering components to get if off. Once again, not the case with traditional bearings. A quick shot of grease and retorque doesnt even require removing the wheel. Even if you are going all the way down to races, still dont have to remove the spindle. And in a pinch all you need is a hammer and a few punches to do so.
Around here (far from so-cal) its pretty routine for unit bearings to go in less than 75k. Lots of gravel roads, snow, ice, deicer…. Rough roads and contamination. All plays into it. And they simple do not last.
85_Ranger4x4
Well-known member
One advantage to sealed is they are sealed better. There are only two seals to leak.
Generally you don't destroy anything else when you do the pressing. Cracking the knuckle is a fear because they are nothing close to flat and it is hard to press straight.
On mine I have the wheel seal, spindle seal, where the lockout hub sits against the rotor and the lockout dial itself to leak water.
Warm bearings will gulp water when quickly cooled in water, nothing you can really do about it.
Generally a failed unit bearing can growl for quite awhile. Usually they kill the abs sensor before they make noise... which on some newer 4wds takes out 4wd too.
Generally you don't destroy anything else when you do the pressing. Cracking the knuckle is a fear because they are nothing close to flat and it is hard to press straight.
On mine I have the wheel seal, spindle seal, where the lockout hub sits against the rotor and the lockout dial itself to leak water.
Warm bearings will gulp water when quickly cooled in water, nothing you can really do about it.
Generally a failed unit bearing can growl for quite awhile. Usually they kill the abs sensor before they make noise... which on some newer 4wds takes out 4wd too.
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broncobowsher
Adventurer
So a Honda Pilot has a press in unibearing.
Nearly everything else these days is a bolt in. 3 or 4 big bolts and the bearing is free of the knuckle.
You can get unibearings with free spinning hubs, Ford puts them on in the factory.
Nearly everything else these days is a bolt in. 3 or 4 big bolts and the bearing is free of the knuckle.
You can get unibearings with free spinning hubs, Ford puts them on in the factory.