CA Coastal Commission to revoke [ALL] OHV access to Pismo Dunes

rayra

Expedition Leader
No, being banned for all of last December / remainder of 2018 for complaining about the immoderate moderation was sufficient demonstration.
 

shade

Well-known member
No, being banned for all of last December / remainder of 2018 for complaining about the immoderate moderation was sufficient demonstration.
Well, I'm glad we all learned not to do something so, dare I say, immoderate.
 

rayra

Expedition Leader
bah, now you're just baiting. Cut the unctuousness back by about 400%


https://www.ar15.com/forums/General...o-revoke-OHV-access-to-Pismo-Dunes/5-2233490/

krammitthefrog
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Link Posted: Today 10:43:03 AM EDT



The plovers have been an area of contention here for decades.

My dad was the maintenance director at the local UC school and he told me all the [BS] the professor in charge of that "study" tried to get away with. Moved in on the bluffs and it became her little sanctuary that the University had the privilege of paying for and maintaining.
 

shade

Well-known member
Some things I have learned over the years and I am happy to see some if it displayed here. Question every statemrnt made and ask for scientific proof, check the science and conclusion. Many times people express feelings for facts.
For me, that's one of the most irritating aspects of land use debates. Without good data, good decisions can't be made. If any side is allowed to base their position on hand waving & tears, the outcome is dubious.
 

Mike W.

Well-known member
Science in today's world is not on facts but who's footing the bill..Take a lesson from the Global warming debacle.
 

shade

Well-known member
Science in today's world is not on facts but who's footing the bill..Take a lesson from the Global warming debacle.
Science is a tool, and just like any tool, it can be used properly or improperly. If someone isn't willing to scientifically approach a subject, then it just becomes a subjective opinion fest, where the most popular opinion wins. If that's how you feel, this was over before it began because the Closers already have opinion and numbers on their side.

I suggested having an independent group conduct a scientific study. Though difficult, I'm sure it's possible to create a group that just want to let the science lead them to conclusions, not the reverse. People have reported seeing a dust cloud coming from the dunes, so it's not a stretch to believe there's dust blowing off the dunes, is it? Find out if that's true, find out why it's happening, and develop measures to address it - if possible or necessary.
 

Mike W.

Well-known member
The dust blowing off the dunes isn't a problem science is needed to figure out..its pretty simple the dust blows off the dunes when the wind blows..the dust blows if people are using the beach or if nobody is using the beach.

California is a losing battle. I have 45 years of enjoying the dunes. I have watched them slowly chip away. Some of the best dunes were shut down in 1989 and now sit no different then they were 30 years ago..

I'm a realist and would love to see the dunes open but know its a losing battle. California is a losing battle. If not this go around the next. My Good Luck and Good Bye to my friends still stuck in that purgatory are heartfelt..
 

shade

Well-known member
The dust blowing off the dunes isn't a problem science is needed to figure out..its pretty simple the dust blows off the dunes when the wind blows..the dust blows if people are using the beach or if nobody is using the beach.
Ok, prove it. Good luck with that.

Science may be able to prove if the blowing dust is worse due to traffic on the dunes, and if there are ways to mitigate the dust if it is a result of the traffic. It's also the only realistic way for the minority users of the dunes to combat the majority that wants to close them to motorized traffic. I don't think that's difficult to understand.
 

Mike W.

Well-known member
It is that simple..Sit on the beach and watch it with your own eyes. I honestly don't need science to tell me the wind is why the sand is blowing. Science isn't always the answer in fact in most case science is the problem..That is unless you feel man can control the environment and weather. Of course man can't give you a reliable weather forecast.
 

shade

Well-known member
It is that simple..Sit on the beach and watch it with your own eyes. I honestly don't need science to tell me the wind is why the sand is blowing. Science isn't always the answer in fact in most case science is the problem..That is unless you feel man can control the environment and weather. Of course man can't give you a reliable weather forecast.
I don't think you understand, or want to understand, so I'll leave you be.
 

shade

Well-known member
How much time have you spent on the dunes in Pismo?
I have driven by Pismo. I'm not into what occurs there, but that's immaterial to a discussion about keeping access open to Pismo, or access open to any other place. Maybe you haven't understood that point, either.

Understanding the arguments for closure is fundamental to combating them, no matter where the land is found. Whether you want to admit it or not, the Closers have been using science to gain the upper hand in swaying the opinion of the general public in their favour. It's perfectly acceptable to debate the veracity of scientific findings (that's how science is supposed to work), but they should be countered with more science.

Pigheadedly sticking to unsupported opinions does nothing but reinforce the arguments of the Closures with the general public.
 
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