Byways not Highways: Gen 3 2004 Montero Limited Build

[jasonsuperb]

Thanks for the ideas everyone. Surprisingly it hasn’t tripped the check engine light at all. I do have a ibd2 scanner on order to hopefully shed some more light on the subject. It also seems to run fine and seems peppy. I checked the radiator for bubbles. Opened the bleed bolts and filled the radiator till water came out then shut everything back up. Haven’t bled them while the car is hot and running yet. However the antifreeze looks old and the cap is is covered in something nasty.

some gunk in the filler neck as well. Definitely plan to flush it sooner than later, but was gonna wait and do it at the same time as the water pump and timing belt. Not sure if they have ever been changed. As far as the temp gauge it shows cold at start up and comes up to a little below the middle of the gauge and stays steady there. Also does the radiator fan run non stop in these? I was surprised to see it running when I started the engine cold. Seems like It would make more sense to not kick on till it’s needed.


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[jasonsuperb]

Took the Montero out for another little adventure today and parked down by a creek for about an hour while we played in the water with our dog. We even found a bird nest oddly in the middle of the stream. Anyway. When we left, in under a minute of driving, I noticed the temp gauge climbing way past normal. I pulled over and was gonna just let it idle while I popped the hood but It kept climbing to the top of the gauge so I shut the car off. Popped the hood expecting to see steam but nothing. Waited a minute or two and turned the key to accessory to check the temp and it was back to normal. Started it up and drove about 25 miles home with no issue at all. Would this indicate I just have a bad sensor or something that could also be behind why my mpg seems way off?

Photos from today.

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[corprin]

ASFIR makes very nice aftermarket armor for the Gen. III, however, the cost of shipping kept their products out of reach IMHO.

My skids were $77 for shipping. Not bad for the weight.

 

[Inyo_man]

The temp. gauge on the Gen III Montero has an issue with the soldering on the panel. It may come loose and gives inaccurate readings.
My temp. gauge started this same thing a few months ago. It will read normal, and then suddenly spike for no reason.
I use an UltraGauge scanner that connects to the OBDII port under the dash to monitor various aspects of the vehicle's operating data.
The digital read-out on the scanner shows no change in temp., so I know the issue is the connection. I have not taken the dash out in order to repair the connection.
(However, by the looks of your radiator cap a full engine flush is in order asap...remember to pull the plug from the engine block as well.)
Cheers

 

[Inyo_man]

My skids were $77 for shipping. Not bad for the weight.

Perhaps I'm a low budget fella, but, that shipping cost was close to half the budget for making my two skid plates.

 

[corprin]

Perhaps I'm a low budget fella, but, that shipping cost was close to half the budget for making my two skid plates.

Not budget at all. Just a 3yo and 1yo to chase. The monty is a very back burner for the rest of life. Lol

 

[jasonsuperb]

Second tank 14.2mpg

Just got a scanner and obd fusion app for iPhone. Still figuring out everything it can do but after my first drive with it was surprised the 02 sensors were jumping all over the place. Specifically 02 sensor 1. It would be around .7 then drop to almost 0 then back to around .7. The second sensor was more regular but would jump around a bit as well. Not sure what they should look like though.

The only code it showed was a pending PO456. “Very small evaporative emissions leak detected” not sure what the pending part means. Maybe the leak is too small to trigger the check engine light.


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[coffeegoat]

No idea if it could trigger it, but I know the top cap of my carbon filter cracked and was leaking, I believe it was giving me some weird evap stuff, in particular in my case whenever I filled up the tank it was under vacuum. I hot glued it back together and it solved the issue.

 

[1morebike]

Little update. Took the Montero out to do some exploring yesterday. Still below freezing here in Pennsylvania. Hoping that changes soon! Took it down to buttermilk falls near the Allegheny river in Pennsylvania.

Have some videos I’ll try to upload as well. 1 is on my instagram.
Did very well and only had a little problem getting up a slippery rock ledge out of a creek. But after a few tries and learning how to let the traction control work it popped out.

Before the adventure though I filled up for the second time, first time full tank of me driving, and was surprised to only get 13.5 mpg. That’s what my Landcruiser fj60 gets with a 6.0 liter v8 6” lift and 35” tires. Something seems off. I also drive very conservatively and almost none of that tank could be considered city driving. Also both times I filled up when I started driving I realized the tank wasn’t totally full. Close but just below the full mark. But since I was trying to get an idea of mpg I just filled it until It clicked off. Both times I filled up shortly after the light came on and put in around 18-19 gallons. I did disconnect the battery after buying it to install a stereo, Ive heard it needs to learn your driving style or something after disconnecting the battery. Anyone have any ideas? I’ve also read somewhere that they run rich in stock tune and adding a piggyback computer can really help mpg? Anyone have luck with that? I’m hoping it was just a fluke and we’ll see how the next tank goes.


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I would check to see if you have a brake dragging. I just went through this ( it's a long story) any way I would check because it could explain your gas mileage and you traction control light. Now that mine is fixed right it like a new truck .

 

[jasonsuperb]

Got stranded at work today. Started the montero up to drive home and it wouldn’t idle then the check engine light came on. Used my scanner to check for codes got this.

Gonna try to keep this short but maybe this will help in a diagnosis. Any insight Is very appreciated.
I got an oil change about a month ago and the shop checked the air filter and somehow cracked a little lip off the lid of the box and it wouldn’t run after the oil change. After taking it all apart again and making sure it was on straight it started and idled fine. This was before I had my scanner so I disconnected the battery to get rid of the check engine light and it’s run fine ever since. I figured that little lip on the box wasn’t important in making the seal because it didnt really look like it did. But now it’s doing the same thing it did that day so I’m wondering if it’s related or a different issue.

I took apart the airbox trying to see if anything looked off and put it back together making sure it was all square but no dice after a number of tries.

Anyone have this issue with the brittle airbox after all these years? Also anyone know what this empty connector is?

Thanks again!


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[haolepinoy]

Anyone have this issue with the brittle airbox after all these years? Also anyone know what this empty connector is?

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Jason, I did a little investigating on this connector for you. While at the junkyard looking over an '01 Limited I saw this connector, which plugs into all the evap. stuff that fills the space on the '01 -'02 3.5L Monteros. My '03 3.8L Limited does not have that connector in the loom. Looking at your B-48 connector I noticed that there is a green paint mark. Any reason or indication that your loom might have been replaced at some point in its previous ownership? Most pick and pull yards will mark used parts with a paint pen, making me wonder if that is the original loom. The wiring looms on the 3.5L and 3.8L Monteros are not identical, having many different components along the way. I'm wondering if you've got a bit of a mismatch in your loom where someone tried to piece in an older loom to fix a previous problem, creating more issues as a result. Your pending p0456 evap code and the recent p0102 MAF voltage issue may be related to the wrong loom being in place. Check it for splices or other unused connectors. Check the top and back of your intake plenum for components that are not hooked up or suspect looking.

Here's a pic of the '01 Limited's engine bay by the airbox. Our 3.8L engine bays lack all that stuff.


Oh, and regarding the intake air boxes being brittle...must have been a bad era for the Japanese plastic industry. I've never seen a Gen3 air box that wasn't broken until yesterday at the junk yard. You've likely got a good handful of broken plastic parts under the hood.

 

[haolepinoy]

Just got a scanner and obd fusion app for iPhone. Still figuring out everything it can do but after my first drive with it was surprised the 02 sensors were jumping all over the place. Specifically 02 sensor 1. It would be around .7 then drop to almost 0 then back to around .7. The second sensor was more regular but would jump around a bit as well. Not sure what they should look like though.

Regarding O2 Sensors, here's the basics:

• The upstream (pre catalytic converter) sensor is supposed to oscillate constantly somewhere between 0.1v and 0.9v, with a reading of 0.45v indicating a perfect 14.7:1 air/fuel mixture. The constant oscillation is the PCM adjusting fuel trims to compensate for rich and lean conditions.
• The downstream (post catalytic converter) sensor will be a steadier reading around 0.5v.
• It gets more complicated from here as you begin to dabble in understanding short and long term fuel trims. I recommend spending some time on YouTube learning from the likes of ScannerDanner, Schrodingers Box, or Engineering Explained (or any number of others...though I'd stay away from Scotty).

Your traction control warning lights that have come on in the past, here's something to consider regarding them from my experience. I'd have the two traction control lights come on together with the Service Engine Soon light on random road trip for the longest time. Problem always was that by the time I could get access to a scanner to read the OBD codes they had already cleared. I got an Ultra Gauge so that I could have real time data and found out that this random code that would come and go on longer road trips was a bad O2 sensor code. It would often show up as a pending code (which isn't enough to thrown a CEL on the dash), which I would never have known without the Ultra Gauge telling me. Terrible thing too about the whole thing is how it would come and go randomly forever, and whenever I was reading live data with my scanner to try and diagnose things it would act normal. Super hard to pinpoint the issue until I got something that read live data. The bad O2 sensor made my Gen3 run super rich in the fuel trim department, leading to the terrible mpg (13 if I was lucky). New sensors, problem gone (so far). Not saying this is why you've got the dash lights or poor mpg...but just some data to consider as you learn about your PCM-dependent engine and figure out its gremlins.

 

[jasonsuperb]

Anyone have this issue with the brittle airbox after all these years? Also anyone know what this empty connector is?

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Jason, I did a little investigating on this connector for you. While at the junkyard looking over an '01 Limited I saw this connector, which plugs into all the evap. stuff that fills the space on the '01 -'02 3.5L Monteros. My '03 3.8L Limited does not have that connector in the loom. Looking at your B-48 connector I noticed that there is a green paint mark. Any reason or indication that your loom might have been replaced at some point in its previous ownership? Most pick and pull yards will mark used parts with a paint pen, making me wonder if that is the original loom. The wiring looms on the 3.5L and 3.8L Monteros are not identical, having many different components along the way. I'm wondering if you've got a bit of a mismatch in your loom where someone tried to piece in an older loom to fix a previous problem, creating more issues as a result. Your pending p0456 evap code and the recent p0102 MAF voltage issue may be related to the wrong loom being in place. Check it for splices or other unused connectors. Check the top and back of your intake plenum for components that are not hooked up or suspect looking.

Here's a pic of the '01 Limited's engine bay by the airbox. Our 3.8L engine bays lack all that stuff.
View attachment 448257

Oh, and regarding the intake air boxes being brittle...must have been a bad era for the Japanese plastic industry. I've never seen a Gen3 air box that wasn't broken until yesterday at the junk yard. You've likely got a good handful of broken plastic parts under the hood.

Wow that is some amazing detective work! I can’t imagine why part of the loom would have needed to be replaced but it definitely would answer that question as well as give me something to look into with these issues.

It has been running fine ever since I found out what was causing the drain on my battery. The scanner was trying to create a WiFi network even when the car was off. So I have to unplug the scanner when I shut the car off and now the battery stays charged and has been running normally, just low mpgs.

I’m taking it to Mitsubishi tomorrow for a water pump, timing belt and tranny flush. Might see if they will have any info on the other issues.


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[jasonsuperb]

Just got a scanner and obd fusion app for iPhone. Still figuring out everything it can do but after my first drive with it was surprised the 02 sensors were jumping all over the place. Specifically 02 sensor 1. It would be around .7 then drop to almost 0 then back to around .7. The second sensor was more regular but would jump around a bit as well. Not sure what they should look like though.

Regarding O2 Sensors, here's the basics:

• The upstream (pre catalytic converter) sensor is supposed to oscillate constantly somewhere between 0.1v and 0.9v, with a reading of 0.45v indicating a perfect 14.7:1 air/fuel mixture. The constant oscillation is the PCM adjusting fuel trims to compensate for rich and lean conditions.
• The downstream (post catalytic converter) sensor will be a steadier reading around 0.5v.
• It gets more complicated from here as you begin to dabble in understanding short and long term fuel trims. I recommend spending some time on YouTube learning from the likes of ScannerDanner, Schrodingers Box, or Engineering Explained (or any number of others...though I'd stay away from Scotty).

Your traction control warning lights that have come on in the past, here's something to consider regarding them from my experience. I'd have the two traction control lights come on together with the Service Engine Soon light on random road trip for the longest time. Problem always was that by the time I could get access to a scanner to read the OBD codes they had already cleared. I got an Ultra Gauge so that I could have real time data and found out that this random code that would come and go on longer road trips was a bad O2 sensor code. It would often show up as a pending code (which isn't enough to thrown a CEL on the dash), which I would never have known without the Ultra Gauge telling me. Terrible thing too about the whole thing is how it would come and go randomly forever, and whenever I was reading live data with my scanner to try and diagnose things it would act normal. Super hard to pinpoint the issue until I got something that read live data. The bad O2 sensor made my Gen3 run super rich in the fuel trim department, leading to the terrible mpg (13 if I was lucky). New sensors, problem gone (so far). Not saying this is why you've got the dash lights or poor mpg...but just some data to consider as you learn about your PCM-dependent engine and figure out its gremlins.

I played a little with the scanner today to see if I could give me any info. I ran a few tests and got this info. Which is a bit over my head.

Seems there is an issue with the tid $70 but I don’t know what that means.

I should reiterate the check engine light isn’t on and it’s not showing any codes at the moment and is starting up and running fine.

I added some fuel trim gauges and tried to pay a little attention to them but didn’t really know what to make of the numbers. Had 4 different banks and short term and long term. One bank just stayed at 0 all the time and most of the others ranged from .5 to 2.5. One of the long terms I think was relatively stable around 1.6


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[ajm291]

...The only code it showed was a pending PO456. “Very small evaporative emissions leak detected” not sure what the pending part means. Maybe the leak is too small to trigger the check engine light.

I'm having this same code on my 2006. It will trip the CEL if it's logged as pending and it is detected again. It happened to me the other day, was pending, I started the truck to warm it up and when I got in to drive off, the CEL was on. I need to get this one figured out too.