2000 Ford Excursion axle swap question

[amgvr4]

The excursion I just built can lift the front tire 30” off the ground before the back lifts. The larger C on the 1550 axle allows for more steering angle without binding as it has more clearance for the joint. This may not be an advertised fact, but when I built the truck above we tested steering angle allowed before joint bind with factory and f550 and found this to be the case. You are correct that just installing the axles will not change turning radius but when you are custom building a complete steering system they allow for more steering angle to be built in. I have not officially measured yet but I think the turning radius has been reduced by about five feet. I spent a ton of time making sure all the components were working together at maximum steering angle and there is no tire rub at full stuff full lock in either direction. Well worth the effort. As you can see none of the steering components are factory except the box.

 

[Superduty]

The excursion I just built can lift the front tire 30” off the ground before the back lifts. The larger C on the 1550 axle allows for more steering angle without binding as it has more clearance for the joint. This may not be an advertised fact, but when I built the truck above we tested steering angle allowed before joint bind with factory and f550 and found this to be the case. You are correct that just installing the axles will not change turning radius but when you are custom building a complete steering system they allow for more steering angle to be built in. I have not officially measured yet but I think the turning radius has been reduced by about five feet. I spent a ton of time making sure all the components were working together at maximum steering angle and there is no tire rub at full stuff full lock in either direction. Well worth the effort. As you can see none of the steering components are factory except the box.

When you say 30" off the ground....do you mean you lift one front tire/wheel 30" before the rear lifts (like with a forklift)?

"C on the 1550" - are you talking about the "ears" on the axle shafts or the C that is part of the axle housing that knuckles connect to via the ball joints?

If you converted from a leaf spring axle to a coil spring axle, your better turning radius is a result of the new (2005+) axle housing design.

I am not sure how the axle shafts themselves could improve the turning radius as a I am pretty sure the steering box can only turn so much. I am pretty sure I lock it out on both sides. I did upgrade to a later model steering box (2011-2016 I think it was). There are no steering stops on the knuckles of the later trucks like there was on the leaf spring Dana 50 and 60s.

 

[amgvr4]

SuperDuty...
I’ll try not to turn our sidebar into a thread derail but here are the answers to your questions. You no doubt have a better grasp on the specific years things were available and what parts to put together for the best performance. I always forget those details soon after I have finished my research so thank you for bringing clarity on that front.

Articulation is as you stated. I can lift the front tire 30” off the ground before the back looks like it is going to lift. To be fair I could probably eek out a few more inches but there is something rather unnerving about having a truck this big tilted that much so I stopped a little before rear lift for safety sake.

On the axle shafts by C I mean ears where the u-joint fits. There is better clearance for joint rotation at full lock so they rotate smoothly with more steering angle applied. Like I said that alone doesn’t do anything by itself, however when you are building a custome system it allows you to get every degree of angle that the later model knuckles allow. I did this by making a custom pitman arm that is the correct length for the offset high steer knuckle kit from Barns 4x4. By doing this the stop pads on the knuckles engage just before the steering box runs out of rotational travel. I hope this makes sense, but my point is that I could not have done that with the factory axle shafts since the u-joints would have bound up and stopped rotating smoothly before reaching the steering bump stops on the axle. Both sets of 2005 axles I have do indeed have steering stop nubs on the axle C and that’s what I used as my end stop

I went ahead and measured the turning circle of the truck this morning and it was tighter than I expected. A leaf sprung excursion stock is 50.4’ and the one I just built made consistent circles of 44’. It actually puts a smile on my face every time I make a tight turn with it since it is so much better than my Excursion and OBS f250.

 

[Superduty]

@amgvr4

That's a great improvement in turning radius. I know what you are talking about a smile on your face when making a tight turn. I didn't take any measurements on my truck 99 F350 CC LWB 4x4 - it had a horrible turning radius. The turning radius is still huge, but it is a HUGE improvement over the original leaf spring front end. The conversion is almost worth it just for the turning radius. I made a lot of other improvements at the same time - which made the conversion even more worth it.

Your steering set up is very nice. What axle cover are you using? Does it provide some extra support to the carrier bearings or ring gear?

I need to double check if there are stop pads on my knuckles, i thought there wasn't. Knuckles are from a 2015 F250.

I need to find someone with a forklift. I would be curious how much articulation I have. I installed Carli 4.5 front springs and Deaver springs in the rear.

 

[amgvr4]

I'm not sure who make the diff cover, it was supplied by the customer and I think he got it from a small hot rod shop near Sandpoint Idaho. It is designed for drag racers so it does have the bearing cap supports which are completely unnecessary, but I think it was pretty cheap and its HD aluminum so should be pretty beefy. We used Carli tuned Kings and their spec front coils and Deavers but all the hard parts are custom. A dodge 3500 I built with a full Carli 2.5 pintop system and the Carli radius arms was around 24-25" IIRC. The big difference comes from the longer arms and extended rear shackle system. Propper rear shackles allow for a ton more rear droop than factory shackles can provide.

 

[Summitdogracing]

What are you seeing for typical pricing on the Dana 60 axles?


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[Superduty]

$800+ depending on condition and year.

The later the year the more desirable it is in my opinion. Why? The brakes kept getting larger.



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[Summitdogracing]

I found a 2006 Ford Dana 60 Front complete Hub to Hub 72” wms x wms 4:30 ratio Driver Side Drop for $1,500. I am trying to find a reference point on pricing.


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[Superduty]

Axle widths are the same from 05-16 (and maybe even up to 22).

They are all drivers drop.

A complete axle is nice to get. All the little parts add up quickly. Many junkyards won't sell calipers. Calipers are nice even if you just use them for cores.

Don't forget you are now buying an almost 20 yrs old axle, so hopefully parts have been replaced. Steering, seals, hub/bearing, ball joints etc. Unless you plan on going through it all, which again adds to the cost.

1500 is at the high end. If i was paying that much i would expect to not have to replace all the parts i mention above.

I got an 08 axle, but then ended up replacing pretty much everything on the axle except the ring and pinion. One of the reasons was i wanted larger brakes, so i ended up buying steering knuckles from a 2015 and all the parts associated with that year.

Where are you located?

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[RPhil]

I found a 2006 Ford Dana 60 Front complete Hub to Hub 72” wms x wms 4:30 ratio Driver Side Drop for $1,500. I am trying to find a reference point on pricing.


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If I recall correctly, I bought my front 2006 4.30 for 800 a couple years ago from PA. It took me a long time to find a 4.30. Came with radius arms, steering box, trac bar bracket and a few other misc pieces as well. I agree on the comment about 1500 being on the higher end, unless it was recently proved to be refreshed and in exceptional condition. For not much more you would be able to get a full rolling chassis with front and rear axles if you were so inclined.

Also take a look at PMF for radius arm brackets for the frame and some of their other components. Easier and faster to buy them than spend your time grinding and punching rivets.

I just finished buying the remaining parts to do this swap myself and am waiting for them to arrive, good luck with your project.

...

I got an 08 axle, but then ended up replacing pretty much everything on the axle except the ring and pinion. One of the reasons was i wanted larger brakes, so i ended up buying steering knuckles from a 2015 and all the parts associated with that year.

...

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Did you do both the front and rear axles? Did you change the brake MC to match the larger brakes?

 

[Superduty]

I did front and rear axles.

My rear axle is from a 2015, so it has the large brakes as well.

I used a master from a 2010 f250. 1.5" bore.

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[Tim K]

Would you mind sharing what dia hardware you used at the axle end of the front radius arms and how far apart they are (vertical separation)?

 

[Summitdogracing]

Axle widths are the same from 05-16 (and maybe even up to 22).



Where are you located?

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I am in the peninsula region of San Francisco Bay Area.


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[Superduty]

I am in the peninsula region of San Francisco Bay Area.


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There is a guy that regularly has superduty axles on Craigslist. He lives in Arizona, somehow gets the axles from Texas. He used to drive through California with a trailer full of sales after he had X number of them sold and deliver. My guess is with gas prices these days, that's cost prohibitive.

Look at eBay. I bought my rear axle on eBay. I think i paid 800 for a 2015 axle and they shipped it for free from Michigan. It has the e locker and the brakes were all in good condition and usable. Also had the e brake cables.




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[Summitdogracing]

What are the differences between the various years on the superduties as far as the Dana 60 are concerned, e.g., brake size,
Axle width, etc?


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