New Defender Rage/Hate Thread

I think the hood on the Grenadier looks hideous, but lots of people said that about the Defender 2 and I think it looks great. Pretty much everything else about the aesthetics of the Grenadier is pretty great - probably sucks for aero, but so does the Wrangler and I wouldn't mind owning one of those either.

For a long time, I cross-shopped the Gladiator and the Defender, before (mostly) settling on the Defender. I might at least have to give the Grenadier a look, if the towing payload is decent.

I feel that in utility this is what you get; new Defender is far from straight utilitarian but the Ineos is going for that market like Wrangler/Gladiator and where Rover once was. Shoots, even my LR3 is aerodynamic like a brick wall but tall and narrow and tons of room inside is key for me.

If you look at the side or quarter profiles, the hood is near identical minus the duckbill nose from @Corgi_express as the G-Wagon with a taste of legacy Defender step and exposed fenders. They make an attempt for aerodynamics on the windscreen but almost feel they should have went flat like Jeep/Defender and not messed with rolled/aerodynamic A-pillar and curved glass; who knows, sometime small profile designs make huge differences in the wind-tunnel if it was function or aesthetic decision process.

Just needs an orange hood.

View attachment 595623View attachment 595624

(this is my petty revenge for all the Kia Soul comments I've been reading for an eternity)

That is pretty much spot on but I think I still like it.....lol. Gonna look nice if we can get some utility tool hood mounts, roof rack, and a snorkel......lightweight bull-bar and winch if needed and move on.

Would be really really bad@ss if they make a 3-door troop style commercial version.............. :sneaky:
 

pkripper

Member
Terrible pic, but 2nd one I have seen this week. Snorkel looked ugly and not sure about the modular boxes on the side. I will give them credit for having the most factory accessories out there.
aee55e8e1a2c7f5c47e52db765415ada.jpg


Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk
 

JeepColorado

Well-known member
So, my question to all of my Land Rover loving friends on here (@Victory_Overland @Blaise @DieselRanger @Corgi_express) is this. ..... Why didn't LR build the Grenadier?

Is it crash test, emissions etc...?

Are the people who'd buy this just not LRs market?

If this promises to be what it appears to be- this is a truly purpose-built, singularly focused vehicle- why would LR not be bold and recapture the original defender's heritage and build this? They have plenty of other SUVs- why not make an outlier model in the way that Ford has their bread and butter F-150, but they also make the Raptor which comes standard with 35s, King Shocks and can jump?

Carroll Shelby built incredible Cobra Mustangs and once said something along the lines of that he may not sell but a few of the 700 hundred plus types of Mustangs, but it'll help Ford sell alot of V-6 Mustangs. My point being that a really cool, low-volume model can be a lightening rod to sales for other models. Why not use the Defender platform in this way- give something to the core enthusiast that is clearly a direct descendant of the original and let the aura of that model bump sales of the rest of the SUVs?
 

mpinco

Expedition Leader
Grenadier doesn't exist in the design language of a furniture designer. It is that simple. McGovern is arrogant and can't see anyone changing his language, especially the aftermarket. God forbid the past influence the future. Your tell was the Evoque as a fashion statement and the DC100.
 

Buliwyf

Viking with a Hammer
A ''halo'' vehicle, is what we used to call those.

Corvette for GM. Lexus LFA, which actually sells at a loss for Lexus, no profit. Viper for Dodge. Remember when every Dodge had a grill or headlights copied a bit from the ('94?) Viper?

I don't think our younger generations care about such. I don't think any form of auto racing will sell a single car in the near future. Test beds for proving new tech only.
 

T-Willy

Well-known member
I'm fascinated that Land Rover ceded Defender's design heritage to Grenadier. It's like voluntary identify theft.

While new Defender is a remarkable design that stands on its own, it's obvious that Grenadier will be the vehicle that carries forward old Defender's design heritage.
 
My opinion only is that JLR sales alone from the last years of Defender were not enough for them to make money to carry the legacy forward; did business model effect this at some point; YEP! As much as people think it's cheap to just build a line and hope it sells, it really is not a business model to follow. Can't say JLR business model is an example to follow, just saying that look how much it costs to run a separate line on a specific vehicle; almost every manufacturer is using multiple components on multiple vehicles......JLR included. Ford is one of the best examples of a company that saw failure on the business plan with too many model vehicles sucking up too much bandwidth with little return; they have models like F150 and up on trucks and SUV that make money and the rest just break even or loss sucking from profits from selling models. They broke it down, retooled discontinued model lines to build more of what sells and it is working.

Another example of what Chrysler did with all of their niche model vehicles and only a few like Charger, Challenger made the cut but the rest sucked money and bandwidth and would never be survivable. They had all these crazy niche vehicles that were just money pits of production lines with little return.

Not saying it was the right or wrong answer as I do not know; could they have just kept the legacy Defender line running; I'm sure yes but as Grenadier has stated it was a bottom up redesign to meet global specs (Defender never was except a few years) and I guess somewhere along the line those that make the decision said get rid of it and just make a new one that meets modern demand of SUV w/utility vs Grenadier who started bottom up from Utility and may draw some SUV market as well.

Grenadier is still a niche market no matter how you sell it; I love it and if the price remains as stated, they get my order if the support structure lines up. I do feel they have the potential if they can produce the numbers to pull from a lot of markets out there such as LC and Jeep.

If JLR did what Grenadier did, would the Defender sell; yes, I just do not know if it would have sold in the global numbers under utility that they needed to make it worth while in the end.

Not saying my logic is right, I think Ineos nailed it but they are a long way away to see if global numbers on official orders and profit to say was it worth it for JLR or anyone without significant risk to do the same thing in their eyes.

Time will tell I guess. Best I can answer but not sure anyone cares as long as they can point to a JLR didn't and Ineos did to sleep at night.
 
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